Two weeks ago i think i have talked about protection of music CD's on Universal. Now i found that a greek CD has protection because the computer couldn't read it. It has the files in unknown type. Is there any ripper? Help, not immediately.
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Two weeks ago i think i have talked about protection of music CD's on Universal. Now i found that a greek CD has protection because the computer couldn't read it. It has the files in unknown type. Is there any ripper? Help, not immediately.
The News in my local paper today said most C.D's with this protection are being made by Pirater's and not by Big Major C.D companies??
So buy from Big Shops....
C.D writers can't read these disks!!!
The major labels, have started releasing discs in europe with their new encryption. It is not all CDs that have this, but random ones. There is no way to rip it without external audio hardware.
It's popping up on major labels now. But, I can't see what all the hype is about. I took my friend's FAST & FURIOUS CD, put it into my CD Player that's connected to my PC soundcard, and recorded the music to MP3 with Streambox Ripper. Sounds just as good.
This new protection is a pretty lame attempt that can be thwarted by a "low tech" approach.
:ubergun:
Really. It's pretty rediculous, because ONE WAY OR ANOTHER, the sound gets to your speakers. And you can just take that analog information and digitize it, and amazingly you have a digital version which is NOT protected and is nearly the exact same. It's *repeated* analog copies that cause signal degradation. The industry is being pretty stupid, because there will always be someone out there willing to make these 'captured-output' versions, in which case most people will just download that, instead of trying to unsuccessfully rip their own.Quote:
Originally posted by ASTRIDPESHEK
This new protection is a pretty lame attempt that can be thwarted by a "low tech" approach.
Hey guys, this is not part of the main topic, but I think it can be parallel to it. What about DVD encryption, with Phillips comming out with a new DVD burner, what encyption, if any, will be out there on the market - and what are you doing to bypass it, if anything at all? So far companies have done a pathetic job at:
- Stopping MP3
- Stopping pirated music
- Stopping p2p (person to person file transfers)
- Significantly encrypting their music/movies
....disscussions are appreciated.
I think that both movies and music will be pretty unstoppable, the only thing the companies can really add is inconvenience. At the most basic level, a person can just record what is coming out of his speakers. After that, from an electronic perspective, who can say that the recorded information is copyrighted? It's just a digital representation of an analog playing... Unless you have software that detects key song phrases, or something... but that would have to be in the recording/burning process, and sounds a bit too complex to be workable.Quote:
Originally posted by [WebCarnage]
Hey guys, this is not part of the main topic, but I think it can be parallel to it. What about DVD encryption, with Phillips comming out with a new DVD burner, what encyption, if any, will be out there on the market - and what are you doing to bypass it, if anything at all?
DVDs... similar. In the sense that they can be interactive, they're probably going to be a tougher nut. But if you don't want to replicate the exact interactivity, instead just wanting the actual movie clips, what's to stop someone from just recording the analog-to-the-TV signals from the player, digitizing them, and burning their own CD/DVD with the footage? Even if the signal to the TV is digital, it wouldn't appreciably make it more difficult if you have the right tools.
I think the whole idea is doomed. A technological fix is not what is needed, what is needed is a new marketing or economy fix. A way to influence the minds behind the machines.
Yeah but you don't have digital quality, just an analog copy. And, no offense, but mp3 does not sounds as good as a real audio CD (DDD mastered). It is impossible to get the same music depth with this low tech approach. I would say: listen to the original CD and your copy on a studio monitor system (let's say B&W speakers with a Mos-Fet class AA amplifier and you will hear the difference.Quote:
Originally posted by ASTRIDPESHEK
It's popping up on major labels now. But, I can't see what all the hype is about. I took my friend's FAST & FURIOUS CD, put it into my CD Player that's connected to my PC soundcard, and recorded the music to MP3 with Streambox Ripper. Sounds just as good.
This new protection is a pretty lame attempt that can be thwarted by a "low tech" approach.
:ubergun:
There's a way to make a digital copy anyway: use the professional recording ecquipment from Marantz
(the 500, 631, 770 recorder)
they can edit the SCMS copy protection.
http://www.marantz.com/pdfs/e_cdr_cdr770.pdf
or from DENON: the DN-C550R ignores copy protection
http://www.denon.com/catalog/photo.a...PG&c=54 <br />
Only negative thing: these things are (very) expensive.
Im not sure if this will work, but it sounds like a good idea to me. If normal cd players can read these protected cd's, then why dont you plug your discman or stereo into the computer and capture it while it playing? Sounds like a sure fire play to me. And another thing, since burners can't read these special cd's, I wonder if those new discmans that can play mp3 cd's and RW's will be useless trying to play these "protected" cd's. Anyhow, I think the companies are just being stupid... :drink: There is always a way aroung something
:hiphop:
Anyhow, if someone tries this, let me know. It will be interesting.
Hum... tridentrue my reply was against some post by ASTRIDPESHEK that said what you just posted. You should read my post above.Quote:
Originally posted by tridentrue
[B]Im not sure if this will work, but it sounds like a good idea to me. If normal cd players can read these protected cd's, then why dont you plug your discman or stereo into the computer and capture it while it playing? Sounds like a sure fire play to me. And another thing, since burners can't read these special cd's, I wonder if those new discmans that can play mp3 cd's and RW's will be useless trying to play these "protected" cd's. Anyhow, I think the companies are just being stupid... :drink: There is always a way aroung something
Your way -> analog copy
expensive way -> digital copy
So it could be done, if you have the right CD Recorder/Mastertools.
well.... i have heard this as well... i know some people trying to write a ripper that decrypts it. we'll see what happensQuote:
The major labels, have started releasing discs in europe with their new encryption. It is not all CDs that have this, but random ones. There is no way to rip it without external audio hardware.
I used to be a sound quality judge, for the United States Autosound Competition, and we often had discussions of this nature. Yeah on a super high end system, you can tell the difference between analog and digital(the 12 hertz thunderclap and ambiance). Most people dont have high end systems though. At home on my computer I am perfectly happy with mp3 quality sound as are 90% of other people. Then there is another problem, a lot of the content of CD's isnt digital quality in the first place. Only a sound quality nut with their Rane crossover/30 band equalizer combo and a 5.1 channel pro audio setup would really be concerned.Quote:
Originally posted by VictorKaum
Yeah but you don't have digital quality, just an analog copy. And, no offense, but mp3 does not sounds as good as a real audio CD (DDD mastered). It is impossible to get the same music depth with this low tech approach. I would say: listen to the original CD and your copy on a studio monitor system (let's say B&W speakers with a Mos-Fet class AA amplifier and you will hear the difference.
You've said it all man :cool:Quote:
I used to be a sound quality judge, for the United States Autosound Competition, and we often had discussions of this nature. Yeah on a super high end system, you can tell the difference between analog and digital(the 12 hertz thunderclap and ambiance). Most people dont have high end systems though. At home on my computer I am perfectly happy with mp3 quality sound as are 90% of other people. Then there is another problem, a lot of the content of CD's isnt digital quality in the first place. Only a sound quality nut with their Rane crossover/30 band equalizer combo and a 5.1 channel pro audio setup would really be concerned.
Alright, you two (ThePreacher and Tridentrue) are right at some point,Quote:
Originally posted by ThePreacher
I used to be a sound quality judge, for the United States Autosound Competition, and we often had discussions of this nature. Yeah on a super high end system, you can tell the difference between analog and digital(the 12 hertz thunderclap and ambiance). Most people dont have high end systems though. At home on my computer I am perfectly happy with mp3 quality sound as are 90% of other people. Then there is another problem, a lot of the content of CD's isnt digital quality in the first place. Only a sound quality nut with their Rane crossover/30 band equalizer combo and a 5.1 channel pro audio setup would really be concerned.
but ThePreacher I was talking about DDD CD's they are full Digital and you probably heard the differnce too?
I did :)
the difference between a regular sound system and a super high end (like you call it) can only be heard if you put the 2 next to each other and listen (separate) to the first and then to the second.
- The regular system sounds like noise (the louder the system plays the more there is transformation / distortion / sound compression, etc... there is no real increase of sound anymore)
that's not all, most of these uses bass speakers that make the typical BOOM bass sound. This is NOT the real bass!
What you feel when listening is: pain in the ears
- The super high end system sounds on all levels excellent, you get the music how it was ment to be, pure. The bass is short and powerfull, the mid's are crystalclear on all soundpressure levels and the high's are crispy.
What you feel when listening is: emotion
I like some neutral sound reproduction I don't need the transformation made by the speakers.
Concerning MP3's: It doesn't matter on wich system they are played the quality is always lower than the original CD Digital recording. It could even be that on a high end system they will sound worse cause you can hear all the faults.
My point was: how to make a digital copy
Yes VictorKaum, it's true that people can make analog copies, but with analog copies, the sound isn't that bad. Yes, music that is 320 kbps, is very good to have (and very rare for that matter), but 120 kbps isn't that bad to have eitiher. I have plenty of songs that are 120 kbps and are fine by me. It's not like I'm reselling the music on burned home-made CD's. Also, 192 kbps is near CD quality. So you don't need an ub3r-1337 digital copier to get good music. After all...we could be still stuck with vinal. :)
Well, all I had meant was that the only needs to be one analog copying, before and after that the signal can be digital, and with all the sound-quality issues that entails, it's not analogous to making copies with, say, casette tapes. Though yes, if you redirect your player cable to the (TV/Audio)-in jack of your whatever-purpose-pci card, there probably will be some degradation.
Now you touched the real thing: vinylQuote:
Originally posted by [WebCarnage]
Yes VictorKaum, it's true that people can make analog copies, but with analog copies, the sound isn't that bad. Yes, music that is 320 kbps, is very good to have (and very rare for that matter), but 120 kbps isn't that bad to have eitiher. I have plenty of songs that are 120 kbps and are fine by me. It's not like I'm reselling the music on burned home-made CD's. Also, 192 kbps is near CD quality. So you don't need an ub3r-1337 digital copier to get good music. After all...we could be still stuck with vinal. :)
Nothing goes above vinyl when it comes to warm sound.
Vinyl is analog and has bad S/N ratio but you get: emotion.
I'am a DJ and I play vinyl all the time. Vinyl definitly rulez when it comes to mixing. Nothing can touch that feeling.
Now the same goes for ub3r-1337 high end systems: they are able to give you a warm, clear sound reproduction. Listen to such a system and you get also emotion.
you do need an ub3r-1337 digital copier if you want to get the best quality, I canot help not every1 want best quality. :)
Hehe, so your a security expert AND a disk jockey. Whoa babe... I must admit, thats a feat yet to be accomplished by 99% of the worlds population. :) Vinyl is great. ...but it's size is the thing I hate. Imagine "portable 12" vinyl players - if you have a big enough pocket, but it! :)"Quote:
Originally Posted by: VictorKaum
Now you touched the real thing: vinyl
Nothing goes above vinyl when it comes to warm sound.
Vinyl is analog and has bad S/N ratio but you get: emotion.
I'am a DJ and I play vinyl all the time. Vinyl definitly rulez when it comes to mixing. Nothing can touch that feeling.
Now the same goes for ub3r-1337 high end systems: they are able to give you a warm, clear sound reproduction. Listen to such a system and you get also emotion.
you do need an ub3r-1337 digital copier if you want to get the best quality, I canot help not every1 want best quality. :)
hehe, I'll take your word on that for the ub3r-1337 gear. :)
Thx for the complimentQuote:
I must admit, thats a feat yet to be accomplished by 99% of the worlds population
Indeed one of the negative things about vinyl is the size and the weight. I'am not a strong, 'muscle' person (I'am a light, thin person) so it's a task to get those DJ cases where I want them. But I love vinyl. ;)
Anyway: portable vinyl players exist!
;)
Thx to take my word for the ub3r 1337 digital CD recorders. :)
Few people in the world outside of audiophiles have much concern over signal to noise ratios, as long as they have their full range 5 1/4" speakers that play frequencies between 50 and 16,000 hertz they are happy. No an mp3 will never truly satisfy me, but as an inexpensive alternative to CD's I am happy. However after listening to the Sheffield Coustic Labs setup and test disc in a vehicle equpied with horn loaded compression drivers(not very common in cars) I found myself in desire of only the best in sound quality. Analog signal will not ever compare.Quote:
Originally posted by VictorKaum
Now you touched the real thing: vinyl
Nothing goes above vinyl when it comes to warm sound.
Vinyl is analog and has bad S/N ratio but you get: emotion.
I'am a DJ and I play vinyl all the time. Vinyl definitly rulez when it comes to mixing. Nothing can touch that feeling.
Now the same goes for ub3r-1337 high end systems: they are able to give you a warm, clear sound reproduction. Listen to such a system and you get also emotion.
you do need an ub3r-1337 digital copier if you want to get the best quality, I canot help not every1 want best quality. :)
So we agree?Quote:
Originally posted by ThePreacher
Few people in the world outside of audiophiles have much concern over signal to noise ratios, as long as they have their full range 5 1/4" speakers that play frequencies between 50 and 16,000 hertz they are happy. No an mp3 will never truly satisfy me, but as an inexpensive alternative to CD's I am happy. However after listening to the Sheffield Coustic Labs setup and test disc in a vehicle equpied with horn loaded compression drivers(not very common in cars) I found myself in desire of only the best in sound quality. Analog signal will not ever compare.
Horn loaded compression drivers... cool these things are indeed ub3r - 1337. You are a lucky man to have some :)
I don't know much about how music is done, etc etc, but I know this:
Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 speakers fux0r1ng ROCK for my games!
off course they do: MAXIMUM ACOUSTIC OUTPUT: 106dB SPLQuote:
Originally posted by Vorlin
I don't know much about how music is done, etc etc, but I know this:
Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 speakers fux0r1ng ROCK for my games!
Hell yeah! Although I'd be afraid to crank that thing up. It's like my Surround Sound Sony 5.1 system, I keep the volume low. I don't have to have it high at all before the sheetrock starts shaking, hehe...if I went above 20, neighbors three doors down would be listening to the movies.
This is all pretty much a moot point - the protection degrades the digital audio anyway. So IF someone is totally anal about true digital audio quality sound ..... buy the Audio CD, play it, and don't even bother ripping. You're not going to get that perfect digital quality anymore anyway.
Yeah - you can buy the expensive digital equipment .... but talk about overkill. Why do I want to buy a thousand Euros worth of equipment when I can get a decent sounding MP3 by jacking my Discman into my soundcard and converting it in a few minutes? I like music, but not to that point. And the MP3 portable players - they're nowhere near high-end stereo systems. I guess you'd have to have hearing like Superman (and anal) to hear the difference on them.
A lot of people will groan .... they own the CD, they want it on MP3, etc. But seriously, almost half the people I hear groaning - *don't* own the CDs they're ripping.
I remember buying a Mudvayne CD in Spain last year - and was surprised to see the audio files were in fact mp3's. Yet your right, your probably not going to get that perfect digical quality anymore. But hell, who really cares...Unless you REALLY like a certain song, or have a small playlist - this really won't effect you. Still, though, Terr has a point...that the music [somehow] gets from your CDPlayer to your speakers - so there's a chance. Yet I really don't think (lets pray people) that a whole new encryption will conquer our music industry, at least not one so powerful that you must trash away your CDplayers (Walkman and PC) and buy this new "advanced hacker-proof CDplayer readable player." ...I don't think people really care. Music is music...whether mp3 or some odd file where the company, if successful, might be a monopoly.Quote:
A lot of people will groan .... they own the CD, they want it on MP3, etc. But seriously, almost half the people I hear groaning - *don't* own the CDs they're ripping.
I think people will just find the shortest way of getting it...