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Thread: nothing

  1. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Aha, Negative, you identified the core of the matter:
    Mmmm... try playing with the emphasis on your words:

    if NOTHING did exist <---> if nothing did EXIST

    This entire matter is not about something vs. nothing, it's about existence...

    Saying that NOTHING exists, doesn't mean we can't be here...
    Saying that nothing EXISTS, means we can't be here...
    More the "nothing EXISTS"

    What is nothing? A void where everything does not exist (or no thing exists there)[these are logically equivalent, if I could write the symbols for the universal quantifier and the existential quantifier]

    If something (some thing) does not exist, then we cannot talk about it. [For we only know what exists, and we can only talk about what we know, how could you know something that doesn't exist? You would have to know what that thing is and you would have to know that it does not exist]

    Therefore, if nothing (no thing) does exist, then we cannot talk about it.

    Such that we cannot attribute non-existence to a thing only existence, but I have never run into a Purple Monkey (though if they can make mice glow in the dark, purple monkeys will probably follow soon, but that is a whole other issue), therefore I say that they don't exist, but how can I know that they don't exist somewhere (in a top secret lab, or, dundundunnnn other dimensions). Since these other dimensions do not exist in our dimension (note the stipulation), we cannot say that they do not exist.

    So, even though I sort have lost track of where I was going.
    It follows that we can only say "nothing" within a frame of reference, nothing can only be a comparison to something when we speak about it. However, we cannot say that "nothing EXISTS" because if it does it is not here. In addition, we also cannot say that it does not exist, because well we cannot say anything about it.

    So, there is something to think about, I'm exited to see what happens with this,


  2. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    The problems that we have today cannot be solved with the same level of thinking with which we created those problems. -Einstein
    It follows then, from Einstein, that we can, talk about things that do not exist. In hypothesizing about that which does not exist we can bring those things into existance. Also, consider that from the viewpoint of Western religions the entity that created the world "spoke" it into existance from nothingness.

    It is possible that nothing does exist and it is separate and apart from us..."us" being something. In other words, nothing and something can coexist being different forces that are at work with the realm of the universe...take a look at black holes and quasars as an example of that.

    Noah built the ark BEFORE it rained.


  3. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    but then I said a lot about nothing didn't I?

  4. #14
    AO Curmudgeon rcgreen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2001

    Thumbs up

    We can omly think by analogy.
    "Object A is like object B"

    Then we extend our thinking:
    "Object C is somewhat like object A, only different."

    If god created man "in his own image",
    then man is "like god", but to a lesser degree.

    If god is "the creator", then, by analogy, man
    is "a creator", capable of creating ideas.

    "Nothing", then, is a concept that we have
    created. We haven't seen or experienced "nothing",
    but ,since we have experienced "something", we are
    able to create a concept to contrast with it.
    I came in to the world with nothing. I still have most of it.

  5. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Can you 'think' about nothing? How would you go about it, what would you think of? People always think and if you try thinking of nothing, you are always gonna think of something. Hmmm...I just re-read what I wrote there...sounds confusing - what the hell am I on about?

    OK, well, whenever I try think about nothing, in my mind I get a picture of just a black background with nothing there. I try to push everything out of my mind. But is that really nothing? It is absolutely IMPOSSIBLE to think about nothing...try it!! What are your opinions?

    \"Do you know what people are most afraid of?
    What they don\'t understand.
    When we don\'t understand, we turn to our assumptions.\"
    -- William Forrester

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