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Thread: For the Hate of America !!

  1. #21
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    I've been following the discussions over United States, it's foregin policy, Political influence and if we go deeper we can get into a huge 150 years of influence over the American continent and the planet. Yes it stinks but this is the way it is, this is the way humans behave. Why Europe is consolidating itself as a political/economical block? Same thing, power-influence-money. If it was not United States it would be what? Russia? England? France? Germany? Spain?
    Let's get back in time an realize that all such countries were in some point of time powerfull nations and that they used their power to achieve it's own convenience.

    I lived in USA for 6 years, during college period. I can say that i learn an entire life there. My best friends are from USA and on my daily work i deal with the United States and it's people all day, people that CARE, people that have levels of patriotism that we should in deed copy and paste all over the American continent.
    But definetelly it's foreign policy has not been good at all in the past and i do not see that it will change in the future. Big corporations call the shots and the $$ figure stills is the motion for over 90% of all of us.

    Let's remember that i am also an American, people from Mexico, from Cuba, from Colombia, from Argentina, from all over the American continent and i believe that are many of us that have the same utopic dream that one day we all will be just one great nation, no frontiers and barriers and that the major global objective will be the development of mankind.
    Tudo que rela relativo!!!
    www.ebittner.net with you SOON

  2. #22
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    Well GG I've taken a few neg hits and I view them as good as the greenies cause it is that be objective and it is all information and the value is with me and where I place it. I'm sorry but the result of 9/11 the money involved were well american dollars. So people hate me, hell I live a full life and move in third world countries my wife and her home land, think I like the body guards? Nope and we move about just fine and her family wrongs their hands. What does everyone want Me or my family and what do hey want American Dollars, Why??? cause it buys what they need. So if they should ever topple the US then the money means nothing and they go back to caves. Plain simple fact any illigal activity requires one thing that one item of power any where in the world American money our Dollar. Smile and boy do we give those away as a nation as part of the foriegn poliocy. Thing is I am in no more control then those that wage a hidden war against us. Yeha I got a bit of clout now cause I'm 50 or above I vote spent 18 years in public service and my wife is still in public service and me to the private sector not cause of money but because doing what I did burned me out. This country do one thing if you are young I gained the right to vote at 18 cause of Viet Nam, and I vote for everything, at least I vote..world changed one person at a time and one person at a time it can still be improved. I did not go through in my life time to see a regression, if it takes American dollars then that is a cost. Me my family we do one thing when we travel we sit down and share a meal with the host of where we visit on their terms. Wage war or sit at a meal same problems can be solved and children will not suffer. Ducks and covers
    I believe that one of the characteristics of the human race - possibly the one that is primarily responsible for its course of evolution - is that it has grown by creatively responding to failure.- Glen Seaborg

  3. #23
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    - Well that was just sad greek, and I agree Pale, heh, whole thing makes me chuckle, shouldn't but it does. We're being called arrogant be-yotch-es all this time, 9-11 comes along, we all take a collective dump in our shorts and BAM suddenly our country is embracing a definative stance on terrorism in foreign countries. Our Pres. is 'pressed to action', if only there was a little red button he could push to call a world conference, but no no red button for OUR Pres., he will make America the 'Savior of the Free World Against Terrorism'. I can definatley understand why some 'allied countries' didn't quite live up to what our version of help would mean. Sh*t, to the rest of the world, sad as it is, 9-11 is another case of terrorism, everyday political bullsh*t. We ask ourselves why other countries call us arrogant, when all we have to do is check out our actions after 9-11, going in like trailblazers, six shooters poppin;, yehawin' and him hooin' away. Neg is right, we said 'we need some help', we didn't say 'we're gonna level all the stuff that hasn't already been reduced to rubble in Afghanistan over the last quarter century, is that cool?'. Heh heh, yeah, we're goin' after Osama alright, peshaw. Bimmers right too, I think, we got another agenda, we always do, and always will, doesn't every country?? The kind of things our histories wind up chalking up to circumstantial conveniences of the situation, 'and while our main goal was to end. . . we acquired the means to. . .'. The whole Isreali thingie, it's already been said that it depends on your angle, if I was an Afghani that watched his mom blow up from a tacticle strike in the war on terrorism, I'd go find me a summer camp and learn how to fly too. The 9-11 attack sucks, but we've let our leaders draw us into a vendeta, our Pres. talks of removing an abstarct idea from the world, terrorism, and we've gone Wild Bill Hicock on the Middle East cause we've never had to stand up after being puched in the eye by a bully, and it hurt our feelings. I guess I agree with a bunch of others, America is jacked, but I'm still an arrogant Yankee, America's got a good story, it fun to read and pumps ya up, makes me feel like walkin' around and sayin' 'we bad'.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Info_Au's Avatar
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    This post was takin from our largest newspaper this week....

    As our prime minister rejoices in his return from the Umited States,Some of us in Australia
    are beginning to dread the consequences of his commitments.
    Basically,he has implicated us in wars that are riddled with ironies and tragedies.first..
    The all the way with LBJ style pledge to dethrone the iraqi president.
    So president bush jnr wants to finnish what president bush snr started in 1990,under the overarching banner of war on terrorism.Despite the absence of factual evidence linking the september 11 attacks with the iraqi regime,
    There may never be an open season like this one,Where the US can flex it military muscles
    and plant its foothold stratgically on Arab ground.But if the US is genuinely concerned about
    weapons of mass destruction then why has it not scrutinised Isreal's militery whose nuclear capabilities far exceeds any of its Arab neighbours and can deploy their weapons against the palestinians with impunity?
    If the US is geniunely concerned about digging out the roots of Osama bin laden's network.
    Why is Saudi Arabia wxempt from the states indentified as "Axis of Evil"?
    And if the US is genuinely fighting against terror,Why is it hell bent on attacking iraq,
    Whose citizens have already been terrorised by militery and choked to death by the most inhumane sanctions for 10 years?
    Australia's me too attitude to America means we are implicated in policies that continue the
    rising spiral of terror.The US territorises Arabs but describes the attacks with euphanisms such as "liberate" "Pre empt" and "disarm"..Words never attributed when Arabs defend their territories.
    Indeed the word terrorist is now so widely used by US and Isreal spokesmen that it may as well be copyrighted.It has become synonymous with Arabs and Muslims.
    Have we still not learned that these tactics do not root out terrorists but perptuate them by
    creating a whole new generation of angry people who have suffered and are determined to right the wrongs.
    When president Bush uttered his freudian slip about launching a crusade he may have been more honest to maintain this retoric.He does not need to wage war from christain america against the muslim middle east.Does he need reminding that christianity was born in the middle east and that christians thrive there today like hundreds of my own relatives?
    He does not need to reclaim the christain holy lands from muslims for the christians are already
    there especially in palestine and lebanon.Are we too part of this ignorance and irony when we
    assume the moral high ground and unleash revenge?Surely this is anything but christian.
    But the most poignant irony is peculiar to Australia,Not the US.If we angage in yet another war
    against Iraq,We wwould be committing further ships to the persian gulf presumably armed with weapons to attack iraq.So what do we expact iraqi civilians to do while the drums of war beat closer again?Would we not too run for our lives?Would we too save our children at all costs??
    Would we not take any opportunity to flee for a haven,even if it was foreign like Australia?
    How often does this penny need to drop before we can see the irony? Are we prepared to dispatch shiploads of weapons to scatter the iraqi's but ill prepared to accept the boatloads of same refugees in the fallout?
    Today we tell them it's not them but their leader we are after.Tommorrow we will detain them
    and dmonise them as illegal queue jumpers.This morality is far from the doctrine of
    "Do to others as you would have done to you"Its far easier to distance between Jerusalem and
    Canberra,Or should i say Washington?
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Written by...Joseph wakim Founder of the Australian Arabic Council and multicultural affairs commissioner.

  5. #25
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    Tell ya what d3, we not be bad we be a standard cause we do not fight for our freedom alone we fight for it for all people. Even a young person like you, what is that Yo finger sign thing ya do? Me a prostate exam and I get 60 bucks cause I am healthy. You old enough to vote see you have not given a thing here..call me sad OK....but what are you? Have you lived to se history of your life taught? And if you live that long what as one person will you have given back to your community? Is easy to say elders are lame I did when I was young..so if your gonna change stuff what are ya gonna do? Me I'm ok make my own way in life what I have I pay for myself. Stand toe to toe with me fine. There is no vendeta upon the US part, and you failed one point I wanted to make the source of these things cost money and the method is using our own money to attack the US, so I may be wrong but to do anything in life costs money and err well it is usually funded by US dollars..Dah d3
    I believe that one of the characteristics of the human race - possibly the one that is primarily responsible for its course of evolution - is that it has grown by creatively responding to failure.- Glen Seaborg

  6. #26
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    Thank you very much for that post Info, I never even thought about all the people flocking to Australia.
    Um pale, I dunno where your commin' from, in my post I said I agree with you, and I thought greek had a sad outlook on it, but the rest of it was directed at the topic of the orginal post in this thread by Doc Toke, question being why Americans are looked on as *******s. That was MHO. As far as us fighting for everyone's freedom, I again say peshaw. The only hand signs I throw are an occasional waive and frequently, the bird. I am old enough to vote, and do every now and then. What thing am I supposed to give?? And here, do you mean AO?? Or do you mean in general, if that's the case, well I sure don't have to justify myself to you, but I do contribute, in ways that I think actually do make a difference, but just like you said, I make my own way too, and if i wanted to sit here and do nothing for the community my entire life, that would be part of the freedom I have as an American, and so I say again, we bad.

    As far as saying my elders are lame, I never said Pres. Bush had a limp, heh, but I never ragged anyone in particular, I ragged our actions, and I think our actions have been lame, I'm already surprised that there hasn't been any other type of offense against us yet. I know I don't know everything, man, but if it was me wearin' some big ole decision makin' shoes, the shoes wouldn't walk me over to the decisions that have been made. Ida done the whole thing completely different.

    The point I missed about the money, I did so purposely, like neg said, we contribute .1% to third world causes, man, never saw that figure myself, but either way, we don't contribute a lot of what we could, but hell yeah, for our war, it is our money, and it should be, we're the ones who want it.
    America has been asked to help with terrorism before, we do it how everyone else is doing now, politically, slow, and ineffectual, but now that it's hit home, we want an immediate response from everyone and total cooperation. Sounds like some arrogant son's o B's ta me.

  7. #27
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    Well d3 is an old American expression put your buck where your mouth is as in say it and ya can pay for it. The flag I choose here is of my country got nothing to hide so your an Aussie but post under a US flag why? Be proud of whre you are from you will not be rejected here cause of a flag. We not be BAD..we be for the diginity of human rights even if we struggle in our own country to offer this to all nations within out own country. Yes we have other nations within out own country they speak and we work as a Nation to hear all people but as a person we make mistakes as a nation nothing is prefection. You exclued parts of a thread is what for you p3? We call it avoiding an issue, my effort is not anything with you I stated my feelings in this thread I am American so you have no right to judge me after all I had no clue of you now I do and still I'm like you choose a flag not of your country agree but say I am lame? Stand in the open it is what Americans do all over the world and we are easy to spot and be targets. Know why cause we will have and will continue to die for those not free.
    I believe that one of the characteristics of the human race - possibly the one that is primarily responsible for its course of evolution - is that it has grown by creatively responding to failure.- Glen Seaborg

  8. #28
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    Um, dewd, what are you smokin'?? I hide behind this American flag??? I was born and raised in PA, man, I'm in freakin' yehaw Texas, where the Bush family, who moved here from CT, when Bush Sr. was younger for more of a popular vote, is our priiiiiide an jooooy.

    Your statements bug me, don't throw blankets around, and say you speak for all Americans and this is the way we do things. I don't agree with everything your saying and your view doesn't encompass mine. I never tried to judge you, I wouldn't know where to start, I have a big enough job being judge of myself.

    "We will have and will continue to die for those not free"?? My biological parents are definatley not rich and most of the males on my old man's side joined the Marine's, talk about some opinions and stories comin' from people, heh. I don't expect you to believe me, but if you are an America, as your proud to say, walk yourself into a VFW, park your ass, have a couple of drinks, and ask the people in there what they were fighting for, you would of course have to leave aside the WW vets. Ask 'em what was up w/ Korea or Viet Nam, or crap even the Gulf 'Conflict', they'll give you the "what we were told was. . ., but what I think. . .", and I'll bet you it won't have anything to do with freeing people.

    "we work as a Nation to hear all people"?? I dunno about that one, but I do know that I was much more of a model citizen under the previous presidency, and I feel more repressed, especially being in the bible belt, as the term wears on. The article Info posted had a few lines talking about Bush's slip and using the word crusade, there are a lot of people down here that eat that crap up, a good christian savior to bring religion and morals back to the gov'mnt, and Bush eats that crap up, more votes, he play's on it. "we work as a Nation to hear all people", when you find out who we is, I'd like to know, I really wanna talk to them and see how it's going.

    one nation indivisable. . .

  9. #29
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    Tell ya what d3, we not be bad we be a standard cause we do not fight for our freedom alone we fight for it for all people.
    no... we fight for no ones freedom... we fight to get the things that we feel we need. we act like we are the police of the world (which most countries hate). and the sad thing is we aren't policing the world, we are no better then any of the "evil" nations. we fight to gain resources and power. we fight to end terrorism, a thing that can never be ended, esp since it doesn't really exist. terrorism is an abstract that only exists in our minds. if you go to afghanistan and ask them who terrorists are, they will point the finger at the us. go to iraq and the same will happen. go to israel and it is the palestinians. it is a relative term and it is something that can never be stopped. terrorism is just a good excuse to go to war. we do not fight for other peoples freedom, we just say that to look good. i mean look at us, fighting to "free" the afghan people, people who don't want to be free, while at the same time genocyde goes on in africa and we turn our heads to it. if you believe that we fight to free others and that we have anyones nterests other then our own in mind then you bought too big of a chunk of the "american dream." this is a sad view i know. but it is true and the only way for anything to get better is to first realize what is wrong with our country so we know where to start. like i said before i am not antiamerican, i am anti an unchanging america.
    Learn like you are going to live forever, live like you are going to die tomorrow.

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  10. #30
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    Question good points Neg

    Fact: America is known all over the world for its huge amount of money they spend on helping out other countries. But then again (another fact): if you look at it relatively, you guys don't do **** (The US of A spends about 0.1% of their national income/year on 'third-world'-support.
    A European agreement (1977) stated that every European country should give at least 0.7%. 90% of European countries give more than that. If someone could find our National Revenue, that would help alot with this point. I looked but couldnt find.

    But lets take a look at the National Income. And take .1% of that. Thats alot of money. More money than any other country has givin out.(If you can correct me on that please do.) I think our Charity, and our Handouts are what is destroying this nations reputation. Becasue we give out these 'helping hands' and put on a facade that looks very 'self rightious'. I would have to agree with Preacherman on this, where he perposed that we only worry about our own nations concerns. We shouldnt worry about the starving kids in where ever. Lets leave that to the missionarys. We shouldnt worry about the Civil war in where-ever, lets leave that to the freedom fighters, or terrorist if your on the otherside of the fence. We should, however worry about the Israelis. WHY? Isnt that the source of alot of the hate of America, as bimmer put so bluntly.
    Well, this is a personal opinion but, My aunt is in the IDF, she lives in Tel-Aviv. Most of the time she stands in front of a Quickie Mart(Conveinient Store). Well, if the United States stopped supporting there independance, and their defences, my aunt may not have enough ammunition to cap the suicide bomber headed her way. Ya know, the bottom line is....we should support Isreals Defence, because the Martyrs Brigade, Hammas and all those other groups TARGET civilians. Much like the Terrorist Attacks of 9-11.

    When Japan laid down a near fatal blow in Pearl Harbor, we didnt lable them Terrorist. We lost thousands and thousands of Americans. It was an honorable attack. They Targeted a military outpost. Yeah, there was some Civilians casulties, but that was not their main goal. Al-Quida on the other hand, was trained in Terroristic means of combat. I mean have you seen the training manuals for these guy....training them to pump cyanide gas into buildings, urban combat, how to build bombs, ect...

    Terrorist Defined: One who seeks political change by murdering civilians.

    But i have to ask my self....how many civilians died in Nagasaki, and Heroshima?
    It is better to be HATED for who you are, than LOVED for who you are NOT.

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