We reap what we saw..?

[preacherman481]

Hi,

A verse from the Bible:

"If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves, and pray and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven and forgive their sin and heal their land." II Chronicles 7:14

This is America's only hope.

[Bortz]

I'm sorry . . . I just can't let it go. Preacherman I have a couple of problems with your post. The most glaring one is, why is that verse just America's only hope? Doesn't Jesus' teachings supposedly apply to mankind . . . all men (forgive the gender thing, ladies are inclusive of course)? And if that's true, what's to become of 60% of mankind that believes something else? Hellfire and damnation? Eternal torture? Great.

I have a hard time with the God of the Bible. What an arrogant, egotistical entity this being is. Casts his right hand angel from Heaven for questioning his judgement. Casts Adam and Eve from Eden for eating from the Tree of Knowledge, lest they eat from the Tree of Life and "become not unlike God's themselves". Of course now we have self awareness to enlighten us to the fact that we only have half the goods. We realize we're all going to die, because God is sequestering the Tree of Life for himself. Of course the very nature of self awareness gives us the drive to survive and live as long as possible. But we can never succeed. The world then, is really a torture chamber; just not eternal like Hell.

Anyway, God changes his mind and decides to let us have everlasting life (ie eat from the Tree of Life) but only if we worship him and serve him unconditionally. To demonstrate how the new plan works he sends his only son down to be among us so we can kill him and watch him resurrect. OK. Great.

Ah if only Adam and Eve had taken the blue pill eh? Ever wonder where the phrase "Ignorance is Bliss" comes from? You could put it another way; "Not eating from the Tree of Knowledge means getting to stay in Eden".

Here's my read on religion. Religion is a social club of like-minded humans searching for two things: a) the meaning of their lives and the lives of others around them and b) a way of coming to grips with the one certain thing common to all of us . . . death. I am not condemning religion or anything of the sort. However I do have a problem with some of the tendencies they have; such as arrogantly trying to force their version of things on others. Or eroding the rights of their fellow mankind by placing vestiges of their rhetoric in the institutions meant for all of us (ie governments, etc).

I think religion is a very dangerous institution because it's founded upon it's followers' beleifs. Humans cling fanatically to their beleifs and resist, sometimes violently, to any percieved incursion or obstacle to them. This leads to war between men more often than not. It also leads to violent and cruel persecution of people; people who just want to be left alone and safe in their beliefs. Just ask the Jews. I hear some people gripe about the cries and complaints of the Jews. The Jews are just asking a simple question "What do we have to do to get a spot on this planet where we can live together peacefully and enjoy our lives secure from persecution?" Is that asking a lot? It seems to be, based on history; history that's being written to this very day.

I feel free today. I feel free because I understand and accept some very simple tenets.
1.) Death is certain . . . life is not. Therefore it must not be wasted pursuing anything other than leading the life you want to live among your fellow men. There is no everlasting life or life beyond the grave. I will not enslave myself to that idea . . . because what I'm wrong?

2.) Chaos is the true engine of the Universe. People get all these preconcieved notions about chaos being evil and what not. Chaos is not evil; chaos can have order as well as disorder. Peace as well as war. Good as well as evil. I like to describe it with this phrase "Anything that can happen, does happen. In all places. Simultaneously." I beleive we are in a reference frame the things that happen to us and around us guide this frame into the next instant of chaos in the timeline where we meet up with "destiny". We do have a say in where our frame goes. Our actions (or reactions really) do have a direct effect on our reference frame. The only control we possess is how we react to what happens as we hurtle through the timeline. Everything else is firmly in the grasp of chaos.

I really didn't want to go this far into this; forgive my verbosity. Preacherman, I hope I have not offended you or your beliefs. Peace to us all.

[Travish]

Murder, misery, terrorist attacks, war, wiping out entire races, you name it, all in the name of religion.

If you look at all the terrible things catholics, muslims, wathever religion has done in the past and still is doing, I would not let any God near my child.