who hates the new fascist mangament?

[KorpDeath]

Originally posted here by er0k
blah who cares you all choose to come here. you cant bitch at who paid money for this, to not agree with everything you say.

I can "bitch" all I like and they can ban me all they want, that's called perogative. Maybe I care. Maybe I've put in allot of work here. Maybe I'm proud to have helped people here, because they appreciate it.
Does it matter that I don't pay money for this? No. Is it my choice to come here, absolutely, for a good reason.

P.S. Without it's members a community is nothing. I'm not surprised by many of you not standing up for what's right, but, the hell if I'm not going to.

Streetrunner, you're right you're not omnipotent, but those other threads were on the main page for days and days, you were being selective and you were wrong.

[er0k]

KorpDeath >> sorry but your wrong.

you come here for free. You choose to come here. You cant tell them to do stuff and expect them to listen. Its not yours. You choose this place, you meet their standards, and btw i wasnt talking to you. You didnt instigate this. But ok ..

[moby_duck]

i'm with you KorpDeath, but i'm going one step further because i don't have as much invested here. i'm boycotting this site. feel free to ban me if you like.

adios.

[allenb1963]

Simple question here StreetRunner. Why not notify the member and give them a chance to edit their post before you just delete it? While AO is primarily a security site, we do talk politics every once in a while. Out of respect for individual members opinions, they really ought to be given a chance to correct offensive posts.

I also have to confess that it makes me a bit uncomfortable to know that our posts are judged by a SINGULAR point of view now, and we are being asked to play by rules that none of us know.

I hope you have plenty of time on your hands if you intend to delete any thread that makes defamatory statements about any certain nation...as of late there have been a lot of them.

That being said, I will agree with the notion that there should be a level of decency that all posts should be held to and that profanity should not be allowed. However in my judgment (like it will really matter to even point this out) Jupiter Media should consider using some of the elder members (and I don't include myself in this group) to assist in the moderation of the forums instead of bringing in a bunch of (corporate) strangers who have little or no knowledge of this community or how it functions as a whole. I honestly feel that using this type of tactic will make the transition period go much more smoothly. Just my .02 worth.

[MrLinus]

Some of the "elder" members are moderators. And I have deleted a few threads that were inappropriate or downright degrading. And I had contemplated deleting the one the Rollin had posted but not for the same reasons that StreetRunner had. I believe -- and still have this feeling -- that the thread is from a chain-letter spam thingy. That's what I was referring to when I said spam previously.

Now, I've been watching this thread and have been wondering a few things. First, we all seem quite willing to jump all over Jupitermedia when we think something is wrong or we don't like what is happening. I'll admit that I've done it (albeit a little more privately with one of the managers). But after reviewing it, I wonder if we are jumping the gun. This situation could have been handled differently. A post like "who hates the new fascist mangament" [sic] strikes me as the work of a troll, someone who wants to start an argument rather than come to a resolution or understanding. It is inciteful in nature. Why not ask simple but straightfoward questions:

1. Will there still be an allowance of the community to have discussions about issues other than Security? I've actually started a discussion with one of the managers about keeping Cosmos (but removing it from the front page): My reasoning? Because security administrators and others need to be aware of political events. Cyber terrorism and other acts of terror can affect us. It is foolish to think otherwise as well as to think they won't happen. In addition, changes by various governments affect how we do our jobs.

Have I gotten an answer to this? Not yet. Why? I think and believe (but don't officially know) because the priority has been on the code of the site and getting things organized as well as figuring things out and dealing with the server. If you think this site is an easy chore, go build your own. It may sound harsh but I think you might reconsider the impatience. This site seems to have some real uniqueness to it and has been modified far beyond the template. My understanding is there is some underlying code that is old and some that has errors or issues in it.

2. Will there be an allowance of the community? I believe so but the community comes from the membership. I'm like most people: I hate change. It bugs the crap out of me. But no matter how much I bitch, change will occur. Now, I can sit and bitch about it endlessly or I can learn to bend a bit with the change. Sometimes change is good. I was petrified about being an instructor, figuring I'd be the worst. But the company I worked at encouraged and threw me into a teaching position. It was part of change. Would I go back? Are you nuts?! I love it. I found out that as scary as change is, sometimes it has a nice silver lining. We just have to give it a bit of time.

3. Lastly, it's more of a statement I've seen. Screw you all! I'm leaving!. I call this the toy-box attitude. And you know what? I've yet to find any site that has the community of people that make up AO as it is, regardless of management. This is one of the few community sites that is oriented towards security and understanding the other side. I can't promise anything but I will fight to keep some of those things here. I believe in them and that's why I became part of the community. Go ahead. Leave but I think you are missing out on so much potential before it happens.

I hope that some consider this. It is solely my faulty point of view but there you have it. Do consider it.

Now, that said I do want to bring up one more point. Godwin's law might apply to this thread.

[str34m3r]

http://www.antionline.com/showthread...hreadid=240969

Before I start, I should let you know that I'm not advocating deleting the above thread, but if you blindly follow the principle you mentioned above, then the 'I hate crackers' thread should be removed due to its potentially abusive nature. If you go read the thread, you'll find that it's just a harmless play on words, but if I were having a bad day, I could choose to interpret that post as racist and offensive. Where do you draw the line? As is stands now, the AP system keeps the poster in line and would punish him/her if the community as a whole found it offensive. The more you rely on moderators for the site, the more often you'll have to make judgement calls on threads like this. I know you can't please all the people all the time, but every time you yank a thread that was a borderline issue, you'll face argumentative threads like this one. While I don't agree with the title of this (facist) thread or some of the nastiness that's resulted, I think a lot of this could have been avoided if rollin5150's post had been left in place and you let the community as a whole decide whether we found his post offensive.

[MrLinus]

Thanks for pointing it out. I've sent him a note asking him to edit the post. I found it offensive even if it is a joke.

Edited portion: Followup. I informed stuFFit that I found the post offensive and his reply was that it was funny. He edited the post by adding a line stating that he's white. IMHO, this doesn't change the fact that the post is offensive.

Now, if I delete the post, I'm apparently committing censorship. And yet, I've been polite about it. I have to draw the line. I've asked him again. I suspect that there will be a rash of posts from various new accounts that will be attempts to force the issue about moderation. I don't know about other moderators but some things I will draw the line at. Blantant offensive material I will delete. I will ask first but if it isn't changed, I will have no other choice.

[HTRegz]

I've been sitting here thinking about this (as I have no life and nothing better to do on a saturday afternoon) and i'm wondering.. Would this have gone has far if MsMittens or Negative had deleted the post, or if JP was around and he had deleted it? MsMittens said herself she contemplated deleting the post, would we have given her a hard time about it? or are we just looking for more reasons to dislike the new management because we fear the change. We've voiced our opinions, and I think StreetRunner as done his best to respond to our opinions. Change is coming whether we like it or not, like MsMittens said, so we'd might as well accept it.

I'd like to be notified of the changes and know what's going on, and StreetRunner said he'd pass that on to management. There's not much else we can ask for, all we can do now is wait. I think we all need to sit back and cool down a bit before tempers start to run rampant on these boards. This thread IMHO is one that needs to be closed and removed from the main page.... not deleted, but moved. Otherwise it's just going to keep going and I think right now we should just be forgetting about this and moving on with the future.

[str34m3r]

MsMittens, I wasn't trying to cause you more grief. I was simply trying to point out that there's a large gray area between what's offensive and what isn't, and when posts fall into that gray area, maybe it's best to let the community make the decision. I'm sorry if all I managed to do was add to the confusion.

[stuFFit]

AAAaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrgh!!! Foiled Again!!