Value of certification
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Thread: Value of certification

  1. #1
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    Value of certification

    I am about 2 practice testes away from my Security+ cert. What can I expect to gain in my career by having this cert? I origionally started studying for this as a way to better my understanding. I have been in networking since 1992 and really have covered everything from helpdesk to design and implementation to a short stint as a Director. My only cert right now is an MCP in NT.

    What I am trying to ask is, what benefit will certs have for me if I am serious about getting into security? I currently make very little because I do not have certs (except the one mentioned above). I want to change that as well as become a proficient security expert.

    Snow

  2. #2
    BS, EnCE, ACE, Cellebrite 11001001's Avatar
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    I've learned that certs always look good on paper, but in the end, experience is ALWAYS the key.

    For instance, at my work we have a guy who worked in IT for 3 years with no certs. He can outperform the new guy we just hired who has Cisco certs and an MCSE.
    That's Officer 11001001 to you...
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  3. #3
    The Iceman Cometh
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    In my experience (with both a degree as well as a number of certifications), I find that the only thing the certifications truly offer me (besides knowledge) is something to write behind my name. Sometimes, employers will ask about my certifications, and on a few instances, I was able to earn a little extra money, but overall, they help you gain knowledge which, in itself, makes you more marketable and giving you an advanage over other applicants.

    AJ

  4. #4
    Master-Jedi-Pimps0r & Moderator thehorse13's Avatar
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    Well the first thing you have to understand is that a Cert is not a sure gurantee that you wiil get a better job or more money. A perfect example of this is the flood of "paper" MCSEs out there. I'm not sure I'd let half of them load a VCR tape let alone an operating system.

    The next thing to keep in mind is that employers are looking for a number of things which include Certs but more likely they will look at your experience and a laundry list of other things. Take my word on this one, I'm actively involved in our recruiting process.

    Another important point is that Certs are like clothing fads, they are constantly changing and who knows which one will be hot next. A good example of this is the infamous Novell CNE Cert. I know that my company (years ago) spent tens of thousands of dollars on Novell training for me and today they are about as usefull as used toilet paper.

    To sum it up, obtaining Certs is one small part of a well rounded IT professional. Look to balance experience with Certificates. You'll also need to be able to sell yourself to employers which means you will need social skills. One step further on this, you'll need to be able to translate techie terms to non technical co workers and managment. As if this isn't enough, you'll need to compete against thousands of others who are trying to do a better job at it than you are.

    So you see, it's not what Cert will get me where I need to go, it's, "What things do I need to master in order to stand out from a crowd and leverage opportunities when I am successful at doing so?".

    Make sense?

    --TH13
    Our scars have the power to remind us that our past was real. -- Hannibal Lecter.
    Talent is God given. Be humble. Fame is man-given. Be grateful. Conceit is self-given. Be careful. -- John Wooden

  5. #5
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    That is exactly what I was thinking but I was not sure it was the same in the security filed as it is in my current field. I want more than anything to stand out and be recognized more than my counterparts. That drives me to learn all I can. I have a basic degree but that has never gotten me in the door for a job.


    I am hoping to earn these certs. (security+ and CISSP eventually) to enable me to get the jobs I want. I am very interested in security as it requires a WIDE variety of disciplines to master. I have most of them but I am still not at the level that I want.

    And I really want to increase my income potential. That is, after all, a driving factor for me.

    Snow

  6. #6
    It has been my experience that when looking for a job your certifications are the last thing that an employer takes in to consideration. I have done work as a desktop technician, network support and software support for about five years now with no formal training and no certifications. In January I got my MCSA and MCSE and decided I would start looking for a new job. So far these certs have gotten me nowhere on the job market but they have caused my current employer to "help" me with advancing my career within the company and a few bonuses on the paycheck here and there. That is where I see the value of certifications really existing. I gues it shows that you are dedicated to learn and help the company if you are willing to spend the money and time to get the certs. I know I ramble a little here and there but I do try to make sense. Have a good day.
    May Everyone Find the Happiness That They Deserve,
    Raisor

  7. #7
    Ninja Code Monkey
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    Don't depend on certifications to get you a job. Certifications are just icing on the cake.
    "When I get a little money I buy books; and if any is left I buy food and clothes." - Erasmus
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  8. #8
    AO Ancient: Team Leader
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    As a completely self taught Manager of Information systems with 20+ years of experience "playing" with computers, 15 years of that in network administration and ten years of that in my current position with a staff of six I can assure you that 90% of the battle is the way you write your resume and cover letter and how you then interview if your resume stays out of the trash.

    Rule 1. When I read resumes there will be no spelling or grammatical errors.... Period. If you don't have the gumption to use a spell checker and grammar checker when you write something that presents yourself to others then your attention to detail is zero. Attention to detail is important in this business..... so let's get it right.

    Rule 2. is does the applicant demonstrate the fact that s/he _read_ the Ad? I dunno but I get resumes that have _none_ of the experience I am looking for. None whatsoever!!!! You not only waste your time but you waste mine..... How much more of _my_ time are you going to waste if I give you the opportunity.

    Rule 3. If you tell me about all your certifications you had better demonstrate some experience to back them up. If you don't then they are worth exactly the paper they are written on as far as I am concerned.

    If you don't meet the first three rules you won't meet me..... Period..... I don't care who's brother or sister you are or how much my CEO likes you.... I won't waste your time and you therefore cannot waste mine.

    I learned the hard way several years ago that college degrees and many certifications are pretty meaningless in this business. See, the business, (when you actually have to deal with users as opposed to being more theoretical), isn't just about making computers work. It's making computers work while not dis-affecting x hundred users. It's making them work despite x hundred users by pre-planning and having multiple plan B's all so the users don't know you are messing with their data. This means you need to be technically adept, creative, quick to learn, attend to those details and you need to show me that in the interview.

    Too many colleges teach 10 year old programming languages and call it a degree in compter science and I say B$...... Computer Science is the science of computers - how they work - why they work - not programming in the obscure language the university's accounting department use so the university can have some free programming done by the students and overseen by the teacher.

    I ask this simple question at the beginning of each interview. "What is the relationship between the IRQ, port address and the CPU?". Your answer directly determines the length of the interview and you would be surprised how many short interviews even those with Masters in Computer Science have had with me.

    It's not that I am a nasty bastard...... But I don't like wasting my time or anyone elses.....
    Don\'t SYN us.... We\'ll SYN you.....
    \"A nation that draws too broad a difference between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards, and its fighting done by fools.\" - Thucydides

  9. #9
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    Smile



    Yeah , I agree,

    Don't depend on certifications to get you a job. Certifications are just icing on the cake.
    but the problem I have is-

    Cake without icing on it doesnt look tasty.

    Dr Evil

  10. #10
    Master-Jedi-Pimps0r & Moderator thehorse13's Avatar
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    OOOOO!!!! I know the answer Tiger!!!

    It's an address that the CPU uses to comminicate with a particular device such as a NIC or a mouse. Can I interview a bit longer??!!

    Sorry buddy, I couldn't resist. I like your cynical humor.
    Our scars have the power to remind us that our past was real. -- Hannibal Lecter.
    Talent is God given. Be humble. Fame is man-given. Be grateful. Conceit is self-given. Be careful. -- John Wooden

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