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  1. #21
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    It's all well and good to consider what the people that don't get in will think, but for the most part they will be the ones who go around posting useless crap and don't actually contribute, so who honestly cares what they think. As for the newer members, how can you invite a newer member in when you haven't really seen them repy to anything, they'd have to give it time and if they couldnt' realize that... it really wouldn't be our problem.


    GG: When you take 10 or 20 people who sit in there and post garbage all day long, one person posting related material isn't going to make a difference. The many are always going to defeat the few, especially when some of these people do it because they get off on their post counts.


    Anyways hopefully JupM will do something because this site is really becoming quite useless. Ennis, you said it isn't going to hell but it really is, more and more people who were regulars are coming on IRC and saying it just isn't worth there time anymore. Sure there's many new members, so you could quote stats all day long, but most of those new members have under 10 posts under their belt and all about useless crap.

    In the meantime I've followed MsMittens advice and created a conference room. However I don't think this will work as well as a forum would because no one wants to have to log into a Conference room, considering the useless keys that it generates, it gets to be a real pain in the ass. If you want access to the conference room though, just send me a PM.
    IT Blog: .:Computer Defense:.
    PnCHd (Pronounced Pinched): Acronym - Point 'n Click Hacked. As in: "That website was pinched" or "The skiddie pinched my computer because I forgot to patch".
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  2. #22
    Token drunken Irish guy
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    My criticisms are mild and well I would am interested to see if it actually comes about. I have seen peroids of time like this before at AO, and yes the older members are dwindling but still pop arounf the odd time. I am unsure, I'll sit this one out on the fence.
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  3. #23
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    Why not try and make an active change. For example, take Addicts...try and post more security related threads in there, serious questions and such and work towards implementing a standard. Start more security related discussions, and if the conversation of the thread starts to go off-topic, post again in the thread to bring it back on task. An active effort on your part can make all the difference, believe it or not, especially in a community setting such as this.
    I like this approach.

    I told another member here a little while ago that I would make an effort to stop posting in Cosmos, and since then I have only posted in there twice (shouldn't have done it, I know) one was in a thread that MsMittens started and I just thought that it was a good topic, the other, was political (not what AO is about obviously). This is opposed to me spending damn near all my time in Cosmos (again, good stuff, but not related to what AO is about). I have other stupid post like in chitchat; I guess that's human nature and my stupidity. I also have some security related post, but they only total maybe 7% of my entire post count, if not less. I can think of more than a few others here who are probably at damn near 99% security related when you examine at their posts.

    No one can dispute this is the way it is supposed to be. I read this thread today and I think what you're asking is more than acceptable and in fact is the way it should have been in the first place. I will take advice from anyone if it's good, left, right, up, down, whatever. I am willing to cut out all of my bullshit posts even if it means only posting once a week. Obviously there are more than a few others who feel the exact same way you do about this issue. After all, I enjoy reading just about as much as I do anything else. So here is one person who’s mind you have helped to change in this effort, so why not keep pushing this issue? I have a feeling you will HTregz. I'm not perfect or anything and sometimes I have said things and backslidden a bit. I have no problem admitting that a little patience is need when dealing with me. I'm working on that.


    If they won't make an invite only forum as you have suggested, what about this concept:

    What about negging people from now on who post "chitchat" type stuff out on the front board? Everyone knows by now (except the newest members) that the front board is for security related posts only, so I don't see why violations of this "unwritten rule" shouldn't go without a neg or two. I bet anyone who posts "chitchat" type stuff out on the front board and gets negged for it would think twice before doing it again right? Same for the addict’s forum (again, I know I have contributed my fair share to the stupid crap in there). Trying not to be hypocritical here.

    The end.
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  4. #24
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    Glad to see I've got your support FrameWork.

    I think the idea of negging those who post "chitchat" in type front-page forums is a good idea, but at the same time, it could cause a lot of problems. Neg wars and such, besides APs don't really have a lot of meaning around here anymore, which is prolly part of the problem. Knowing how childish many of the people on AO are negging for chitchat on the front-page forums and in Addicts would cause problems that I wouldn't want anyone to have to deal with, it would really just prove to be even more detrimental, or that's how I see it anyways. If APs were anonymous still that may work, but with them seeing who's doing it.. I don't think it would. Since a good chunk of Addicts is filled with postwhoring you could neg til kingdom come and it wouldn't do any good, someone else would boost the person back up. That's my opinion on it anyways.
    IT Blog: .:Computer Defense:.
    PnCHd (Pronounced Pinched): Acronym - Point 'n Click Hacked. As in: "That website was pinched" or "The skiddie pinched my computer because I forgot to patch".
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  5. #25
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    it would really just prove to be even more detrimental, or that's how I see it anyways. If APs were anonymous still that may work, but with them seeing who's doing it..
    That's a great point. As of now, it's damn near a no win situation unless each of us steps up to the plate and decides to make this site better.
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  6. #26
    GreekGoddess
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    Originally posted here by HTRegz
    GG: When you take 10 or 20 people who sit in there and post garbage all day long, one person posting related material isn't going to make a difference. The many are always going to defeat the few, especially when some of these people do it because they get off on their post counts.
    I disagree with that. I think that it can work given a chance and I'm positive that there are people who would be willing to help you out with swaying a forum a certain way. All it takes is a little effort and patience. I've run a forum site before where posts started to get off topic and you can't expect an overnight change, but if you work towards building the integrity of your content by posting quality threads you'll soon find that other people will follow along.

    I've found that many people I've talked to on IRC and through PM's on here aren't really complaining about the 'post whorage' of the members, but the repetitiveness of basic security and OS questions (ie. Which is better? Linux or Windows?, What programming language should I learn? etc.). The same in Web Development, where I spend most of my time posting. The questions about web hosting and scripts are always the same and it seems like the real threads about design, coding, and serving get ignored or pushed so far down, they need to be bumped to be seen again. I make an active effort there to answer any questions that haven't gotten a response. Sometimes it means sifting through older threads that have gotten ignored. I've even been ignored a few times.

    I even created a Web Development Resource, which is a link farm of useful sites for beginners and experts a like, with some of the more popular sites out there for scripts, validation, photoshop tutorials, backend scripting...etc.. It gets ignored. And it's not because of the useless posts, it's because people fail to look around before posting the same questions. Much like what goes on with the site FAQ and such.

    I don't really think the site is going to hell. I've been here a little over 2 years now, with an account for a year and a half and I've seen much of what goes on here go in cycles. This will continue for a while...and then the site will go another direction and focus more on security for quite some time, with some very interesting threads.

    I think what people really need to do is to start answering more questions, start more security related discussions, stop posting in Cosmos and GCC (ATTENTION NEWS POSTERS: there are plenty of sites for news, so unless you have something to say about the article, besides that it was interesting, don't waste our time.) and bring up the quality of the content themselves instead of looking to the administration for an invite-only forum, which in the long run will cause more problems. I can't see how a new forum is going to change things if the community can't work together in the first place. Only seems like a way to create dissention among members.
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  7. #27
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    Many good points GG. I mentioned in the original post and at several other points that it's not only the post-whorage but also the fact that it's turning into a tech support website. If the general operation of the site could be changed back to it's original focus then I'd jump on the bandwagon, but for the most part people aren't willing to make the change, at least not the majority. There are numerous people who have climbed rather quickly to senior status because of the posts they make (which are all of a post-whore nature, or completely incorrect...) but I won't say any names. However even though they are useless they can't be banned because in like a month they made it to Addicts and became post whores there and everyone in Addicts would greenie them for useless posts (which is the way addicts seems to be going.. scroll threw and half the threads will have utter crap.. yet still be positive) and now the users couldn't be banned if we tried because they've picked up tons of APs for useless stuff. There's definately a show of support for an Invite only, or a _HEAVILY_ moderated forum and I really think one of those two ideas should be implemented... The other option would be to close forums like cosmos and gcc to eliminate the people who post in mainly those forums, however I don't want to see that happen because they are part of the Community. That's where the people who post in the Addicts forum should be posting.... but don't for some unknown reason.
    IT Blog: .:Computer Defense:.
    PnCHd (Pronounced Pinched): Acronym - Point 'n Click Hacked. As in: "That website was pinched" or "The skiddie pinched my computer because I forgot to patch".
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  8. #28
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    Well it's good to see a mature debate regarding the quality of the site, but i don't
    think that people should stop posting in GCC and Cmos, it adds to the site being a
    varied place with an outlet for some away from "just security". Yes there are people
    who have achieved status due to post whorering, but hey that does'nt make me give
    more respect to them due to their status, respect comes from knowledge and insight
    that is forwarded on to the community as a whole and that is appreciated by many.
    To restrict this site to just "security only" would make it boring and unappealing, i think
    to a lot of the members. I had a post deleted yesterday, and respect and appreciate
    that decision made, no biggy. I can't see why this moderation can't be better implimented
    in the Addicts forum. If you over-police this site, it will be to the detrement of it and
    create a "dull" environment that can't really be enjoyed. I respect the opinions of some
    seniors here, and understand their frustrations, but ease up a liitle on the strictness and
    work harder at implimenting change in the Addicts forum. My suggestion, that has surely
    been mentioned before, is to make GCC and Cmos non post count forums. That would
    solve one complaint that has been mentioned here, simple. And an idea would be to
    create a new forum just for tech support. This site is the most used by myself for tech
    help, as well as security, and honestly i don't surf elswhere that often at all. To me i
    enjoy the freedom and choice this site provides, ie, GCC and Cmos, I think it adds to the
    sites overall outlay and attraction. just some thoughts. TidaLphasE23.
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  9. #29
    GreekGoddess
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    As I was saying before, with sort of coaching a forum through conversation, it's not a change that happens overnight. In fact, it can take a month or so before things begin to lean a certain way with influence such as that. I haven't seen you try to make an attempt yet in Addicts to change the focus of conversation from a GCC-perspective back to security.

    And back to the forum issue, my biggest complaint about an invite only is, since this is a learning site too, how are people supposed to learn about more advanced topics if they can't read them or ask questions pertaining to them?

    (I would also suggest that there be three moderators to a forum like that to promote impartiality with choosing who would be allowed to post there. Three heads are better than one and I think also more fair. One person choosing who gets through the door may cause an uproar of personal attacks. ("He/She doesn't like me, it's a personal issue...blah, blah, blah."))
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  10. #30
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    Awwww dude, **** that. Personally I think all of this **** is just another thing that addicts and seniors will entertain themselves with for awhile... then get bored with like everything else. If you want better posts then thats fine but im not going to go into some kinda ****ing AO hybernation away from the "post whoreing noobie scum" just to entertain myself or something, thats just stupid. I think that everyone are starting to feel how I feel about all of this. Like WTF is left? Whats left to talk about? What (haven't) I done here yet? Is this all there is to it? Thus it becomes random rubbish...

    But Frankly now that you mention it, I regret wasteing my time reading the **** posted on this thread and then posting my own **** here on this thread actually...
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