To know my enemy...
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Thread: To know my enemy...

  1. #1
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    To know my enemy...

    The title of this thread is a bit off context with the discussion I hope will take place here, but necessary all the same.

    I am reading the book Through Our Enemies Eyes , by Anonymous <-- yes that's right, and I am finding that my lack of knowledge about US foreign policy is inhibiting my ability to get what I can out of this book.


    In reading this book it tells of how Osama Bin Laden and his movement claim that US foriegn policy has forced them to declare war on us. Bin Laden then goes on to claim that we were the first to strike (pre 9-11).

    I was wondering if anyone here could shed some light on what has lead Bin Laden to believe this... In other words what did the US do in his eyes to insight a war? Why does he see US policy as an attack on Islam?

    On another note: Before people reply I want them to at least have some awareness of who Bin Laden really is. He is not an unintelligent idiot lacking faith or patience. The media and their so called 'experts' make him out to be some kind of cult leader who is funded by others to carry out dirty deeds in order to grant them this "plausable deniability." This however, is not the case. Bin Laden is a religious idealist and a martyr to his followers, he is highly patient, highly intelligent, and a highly calculating individual who really believes in what he is fighting for.

    In no way am I trying to say that his acts are justified, I am simply stating a fact here. And I have found that many Americans like myself have been ignorant and mis-lead by our polititians and media to believe that Bin-Laden is this third rate incompitent who simply has decided to kill Americans because he's a "bad-guy."

    I have found in my personal studies that Bin-Laden and his followers are the most dangerous people in the world right now. His philosophy is slowly harnessing the two most powerful forces in contemporary international affairs... religion and nationalism.

    I'm posting this becasue I want to have a clear and diffinative understanding of my enemy; why he is attacking us, and what we have done to make him do so... and also to encourage others to research as well.

    I am presently in programs that are in accredited by certain services, and I plan on fighting to secure the world from cyber-terrorism and am doing further research in cyber-warfare. However, I find it difficult when I see how ignorant so many are to the threat that faces us.

    This post is made to encourage Americans to look into the threat that faces us. Hopefully, fellow Americans will be able expand thier horizons. It seems to me that many think that the western way is universal. That simply is not true at all and in fact is one of the reasons we are somewhat resented by others, I believe.

    Looking forward to an informed discussion...

    TR
    The real question is not whether peace can be obtained, but whether or not mankind is mature enough for it...
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  2. #2
    AO Curmudgeon rcgreen's Avatar
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    When the Great War came, ***** occupied a position where he got to know only its pleasant consequences enjoyed by those who do business while others bleed. I was only one of those who carry out orders, as an ordinary soldier, and naturally returned from the war just as poor as I was in autumn of ****. I shared the fate of millions, and ***** only the fate of the so-called upper ten thousand.
    After the war ***** tried his hand at financial speculation; he made profits out of the inflation, out of the misery of others, while I, together with many hundreds of thousands more, lay in hospitals. When ***** finally stepped on the political stage with all the advantages of his class, I was unknown and fought for the resurrection of my people.
    Source

    They all claim to be in the right, and even seem reasonable when taken
    out of context This is the propaganda that they feed on, and justify their
    violence.

    WE SHALL ENSLAVE GENTILES
    6. At the same time we must intensively patronize trade and industry, but, first and foremost, speculation, the part played by which is to provide a counterpoise to industry: the absence of speculative industry will multiply capital in private hands and will serve to restore agriculture by freeing the land from indebtedness to the land banks. What we want is that industry should drain off from the land both labor and capital and by means of speculation transfer into our hands all the money of the world, and thereby throw all the GOYIM into the ranks of the proletariat. Then the GOYIM will bow down before us, if for no other reason but to get the right to exist.
    exerpt from "the Protocols"
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    Sorry, I have to completely disagree. There is a HUGE difference between a 'religous idealist' and a bloody fanatic. This guy lives to kill Americans to bring him closer to his God, the more the better, and doesn't care about the methods he uses to do that.

    There is NO excuse, or forgiveness to be found after using 747's as bombs on large civilian targets, nor military ones for that matter. Osama Bin Laden should be pursued to the ends of the earth, then maimed and killed in the most horrid slow torture we can devise. Damn the rules, damn the 'humane-ness', screw 'cruel and unusual punishment.'

    What sane person would conceive such a thing, and tell me honestly, whatever on earth would drive sane, rational people to follow him? For that matter, what kind of liberal IDIOT are you, living in New York, to even concieve to defend this guy just for some bullshit you read in a book? I pity you. I pity your pathetic existance. If you don't bloody like it, go to afghanistan and join him.

    This post is made because my Bullshit meter pegged reading your post. Hopefully, Americans will hunt down the bastard and kill him, and many many others like him. It seems to me that you're quite foolish for taking this stance in this forum.
    Even a broken watch is correct twice a day.

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  4. #4
    Senior Member Raion's Avatar
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    |3lack|ce, everyone has different belifs about different things, if we all had the same opinions about everything there wouldn't be Police Officers, FBI or any authority figure for that matter. You can't criticise him for his belifs or Bin Ladens. Now, don't get me wrong...I'm in no way defending Osama Bin Laden, I believe he should be hunted down and senteced to Death. He's a smart person because he got around USA Intelligence which is said to be kind of difficult to get by. Agreeing with that would be kind of difficult because I have never tried nor plan on trying to get past it.
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    What sane person would conceive such a thing, and tell me honestly, whatever on earth would drive sane, rational people to follow him? For that matter, what kind of liberal IDIOT are you, living in New York, to even concieve to defend this guy just for some bullshit you read in a book? I pity you. I pity your pathetic existance. If you don't bloody like it, go to afghanistan and join him.
    I pity you for embarassign yourself... When in my post did I ever condone his actions or say that he should not be killed and hunted down for the atrocities that he has commited against the US!? Just where the hell did you get that? I specifically stated that I in no way am condoning his actions...

    All I wanted was some clarity as to why he sees our foriegn policy as such a bad thing!

    If you've got a problem with that then F-OFF...

    I've decided to dedicate my life to protecting this great nation from these type of people so don't YOU DARE try and make it look otherwise.

    I DEMAND that you apologize for your pathetic and ignorant acusations.

    When I looked back in my post the only thing that I can even think of that would lead you to concieve of this was my final statement about western ideals. I was merely trying to open the floor for discussion on that topic.

    Really, I don't understand how you could take that the wrong way? All I want to know is what "they" think is so bad about us? Is that not an imperitive question that one should know in order to defend against the threat and counter it?

    Seems to me BlackIce, that you were to quick to form your opinions before you even understood what the post was about...

    Oh and by the way I'm a republican : )
    The real question is not whether peace can be obtained, but whether or not mankind is mature enough for it...
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  6. #6
    They call me the Hunted foxyloxley's Avatar
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    OBL took exception to the fact that US troops were stationed in the 'holy' land of Saudi, during Gulf war ONE ........

    That, and the fact that there were jews AND women in those forces, just made him a tad irritable.

    OBL was trained and funded by the US during his time in Afghanistan fighting the Soviets,
    during this time he stated that a day fighting the Soviets was like a year in paradise .......

    He is aware of the US's strengths and weaknesses in both policy and ability.

    This is one of the reasons that OBL NEVER uses PC's, mobile phones or any of the other 'essentials' of modern living, he is well aware of the US's ability to track and attack such technology.

    One other reason for the lack of support from the OBL camp, is that the USof A has a terrible image abroad, I don't think that the American people realise just how bad this gets.

    A quick look would show you :
    You live in the land of the free / land of plenty.
    They live in sh17sville .......[in a nutshell]

    And on top of that you are UNBELIEVERS .....................

    And for moxnix's take on this:
    http://www.antionline.com/showthread...hreadid=255819
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  7. #7
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    You can't criticise him for his belifs or Bin Ladens.
    Sure I can. I just did.

    He's a smart person because he got around USA Intelligence which is said to be kind of difficult to get by.
    It makes him smart for waking the 'sleeping dragon'? I feel this makes him a screaming idiot wanting media attention. He feels it's bringing him closer to his God, as previously stated. Neither 'feelings' matter, nor do my criticisms - what matters is he conceived, planned, and committed one of the most atrocious crimes thinkable against mankind, in a very deplorable way. How many thousands died in the 747's he used as his weapons? How many more died from the impacts and collapse of the twin towers? Let's get real here for minute and stop thinking about "feelings". Or wait, instead let's do - let's feel sorry for the THOUSANDS that died, who cannot FEEL FOR THEMSELVES any longer. Get a life.
    Even a broken watch is correct twice a day.

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    Sorry bout the dual post but I felt the need to answer Radical, who posted as I was writing the previous, and edit wont let me do this as thorougly -

    I pity you for embarassign yourself...
    You should feel self-pity then for not being able to spell BELIEFS or EMBARRASING.

    When in my post did I ever condone his actions or say that he should not be killed and hunted down for the atrocities that he has commited against the US!?
    Let me let your own words haunt you...
    He is not an unintelligent idiot lacking faith or patience.
    <- BZZZT! WRONG!

    The media and their so called 'experts' make him out to be some kind of cult leader who is funded by others to carry out dirty deeds in order to grant them this "plausable deniability."
    <-- BZZZZT! Wrong again - here's why -
    He IS a cult leader - not all Islam follows him. He is self-financed (well, self- with mommy and daddy's money) as well as backed by 'dummy corporations' who support him.

    Bin Laden is a religious idealist and a martyr to his followers, he is highly patient, highly intelligent, and a highly calculating individual who really believes in what he is fighting for.
    <---- BZZZZT! oops, that's strike 3. Bin Laden is a religious FANATIC, a separatist from Islam in general, who has proven his idiocy, insanity, and thirst for media attention by his actions.

    At that point I quit reading - you were so far off base as to lower my intelligence and those other poor souls who read it as well. The world is a stupider place because of your comments. Please
    If you've got a problem with that then F-OFF
    .

    Oh, one more thing -

    I've decided to dedicate my life to protecting this great nation from these type of people so don't YOU DARE try and make it look otherwise.
    I dare. Try me. I've earned the bloody right - I AM a vet. Who's your commanding officer? I'm quite curious to find out what he thinks about you posting propaganda for the enemy. Get a life you LIBERAL IDIOT. If you voted republican it was because you were to ILLITERATE to read the box you wanted.
    Even a broken watch is correct twice a day.

    Which coder said that nobody could outcode Microsoft in their own OS? Write a bit and make a fortune!
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  9. #9
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    Neither 'feelings' matter, nor do my criticisms
    So why are you invoking them on an intelligent discussion.

    Every last person on this forum (I hope) can empathise with 9-11 and many other atrocities that OBL has commited no one is saying otherwise... so why are you saying that...

    Anyway,

    I thank others for their thoughts...

    Here's another, why is it that OBL believes himself to be right in his stance? Where does he get off thinking that he is going to get anywhere in the afterlife killing others... Is there any law in thier religious text saying not to kill?
    The real question is not whether peace can be obtained, but whether or not mankind is mature enough for it...
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  10. #10
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    BlackIce why do you have to make yourself look like more of a fool...

    He is not an unintelligent idiot lacking faith or patience.
    How can someone of such little intelligence be smart enough to excecute an attack on this great nation!?

    The media and their so called 'experts' make him out to be some kind of cult leader who is funded by others to carry out dirty deeds in order to grant them this "plausable deniability."
    No DUH, he's a cult leader to us but to THEM he is a martyr. And he's not backed by corperations he's backed by followers moron.

    Bin Laden is a religious idealist and a martyr to his followers, he is highly patient, highly intelligent, and a highly calculating individual who really believes in what he is fighting for.
    TO HIS FOLLOWERS MORON!!! I'm not saying that he is? and do you really think he is doing this for media attention? NO! IDIOT he's doing it because HE IS a religious fanatic like YOU SAID!

    So really BlackIce...

    F-OFF

    I really don't think your capable of making a good point. You just can't read and I sympathise with everyone on this forum when they come across every sad keystroke you've ever made : )
    The real question is not whether peace can be obtained, but whether or not mankind is mature enough for it...
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