MANIFESTO: against extremism in Islam
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  1. #1

    MANIFESTO: against extremism in Islam

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    MANIFESTO: Together facing the `new totalitarianism'
    Mar. 2, 2006. 01:00 AM

    After having overcome fascism, Nazism, and Stalinism, the world now faces a new totalitarian global threat: Islamism.

    We, writers, journalists, intellectuals, call for resistance to religious totalitarianism and for the promotion of freedom, equal opportunity and secular values for all.

    The recent events, which occurred after the publication of drawings of Muhammad in European newspapers, have revealed the necessity of the struggle for these universal values. This struggle will not be won by arms, but in the ideological field. It is not a clash of civilizations or an antagonism of West and East that we are witnessing, but a global struggle that confronts democrats and theocrats.

    Like all totalitarianisms, Islamism is nurtured by fears and frustrations. The hate preachers bet on these feelings in order to form battalions destined to impose a liberticidal and unegalitarian world.

    But we clearly and firmly state: nothing, not even despair, justifies the choice of obscurantism, totalitarianism and hatred. Islamism is a reactionary ideology which kills equality, freedom and secularism wherever it is present. Its success can only lead to a world of domination: man's domination of woman, the Islamists' domination of all the others. To counter this, we must assure universal rights to oppressed or discriminated people.

    We reject "cultural relativism," which consists of accepting that men and women of Muslim culture should be deprived of the right to equality, freedom and secular values in the name of respect for cultures and traditions. We refuse to renounce our critical spirit out of fear of being accused of "Islamophobia," an unfortunate concept which confuses criticism of Islam as a religion with stigmatization of its believers.

    We plead for the universality of freedom of expression, so that a critical spirit may be exercised on all continents, against all abuses and all dogmas.

    We appeal to democrats and free spirits of all countries that our century should be one of enlightenment, not of obscurantism.

    I think the Manifesto sum's up what I believe which needs to happen in the Islamic world. The last line sum's it up nicely in the nature of what was happening in Western Europe during the enlightenment. Hopefully this catches on. But the religous conservative forces are very strong right now.

  2. #2
    AO Curmudgeon rcgreen's Avatar
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    We, writers, journalists, intellectuals, call for resistance to religious totalitarianism and for the promotion of freedom, equal opportunity and secular values for all.
    I sympathize with them, but how many people are willing to
    risk their lives for "secular values"? That's a weak ideology
    to die for. In fact, secularism is a negation, and you don't build
    a civilization upon a negation. In the west, secularism is
    a form of pragmatism, a method, a critique of Christianity.

    Christianity has always had secularism as a counterbalance
    to pietism, but those calling us to rise to the defense of
    "secular values" will find their words falling on deaf ears.
    Secularists have built their careers attacking Christianity.
    Now that they have belatedly discovered the threat of
    radical Islam, they sound like the boy who cried 'wolf'.
    I came in to the world with nothing. I still have most of it.

  3. #3
    hmmmm, almost all the western world is seculer. Liberal values, the values of enlightenment in europe were seculer, the values which we have today on liberal democracy, the american constitution, the canadian constitution, the French republic, the german republic, and most other european, latin aman and asian political parties are seculer or have to follow the seculer line once elected.

    True seculerism is not the end all nor the answer to all the problems. But it helps fight religousd fantasism and helps with scintific reason.

    I'm surprised there's not more interest in this. Just shows me how many people here will post thousands of posts when you just show off a Danish flag and say f you to "Islamofacsism" compaired to the intellectual responce to the extremes of Islam there is not a beep.

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    there is no need (or time) for an "intellectual response". there IS a war going on world wide, the time for intellectualizing has passed...and most of the world has slept threw it. some are still asleep

    We, writers, journalists, intellectuals, call for resistance to religious totalitarianism...
    resistance is for those that have already lost. those that are still free will fight to stay that way...on the battlefield if necessary but that really isn't necessary as long as we have the law on our side but we need to keep it on our side and use it. now!
    Bukhari:V3B48N826 “The Prophet said, ‘Isn’t the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?’ The women said, ‘Yes.’ He said, ‘This is because of the deficiency of a woman’s mind.’”

  5. #5
    rcgreen has a point. No Muslim will become a secularist any more than a Christian will. Now, if we can convinse them that secularity (a more neutral term than -ism) is part of their faith, that might work.

    To take an example. The Qur'an states:

    "No compulsion is there in religion."

    Now if we can convince a Muslim to believe this (all we need to do here is to get the scholars out fo the way and tell the Muslim to get that Qur'an off his shelf, blow the dust off of it, crack it open and start reading!), we might get somewhere. Then we can tell him that he ought not oppress freedom of religion, not for the sake of secularism, but because that's what the Prophet (pbuh) said! Nothing to do with secularism. He won't go to Hell for recognising freedom of religion (on the contrary, God will judge him if he refuses to allow freedom of religion, as God Himself shall have made it law in the Qur'an), because that's what the Qur'an wants him to do; it's part of the true Shari'a!

    In that case, Muslims will not become secularists, but will at least accept the secular sciences and be willing to live in a secular state. Muslim naitons might remain officially Muslim, but again, might end up recognising secular values by pulling out those veres of the Qur'an which have long been neglected.

    You see, now we're talking their language!

  6. #6
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    that might work if they let you take other parts out.


    Surah 8:39 “Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.”

    Surah 8:65 “O Prophet, urge the faithful to fight. If there are twenty among you with determination they will vanquish two hundred; if there are a hundred then they will slaughter a thousand unbelievers, for the infidels are a people devoid of understanding.”

    Surah 8:73 “The unbelieving infidels are allies. Unless you (Muslims) aid each other (fighting as one united block to make Allah’s religion victorious), there will be confusion and mischief. Those who accepted Islam, left their homes to fight in Allah’s Cause (al-Jihad), as well as those who give them asylum, shelter, and aid—these are (all) Believers: for them is pardon and bountiful provision (in Paradise).”

    Surah 9:5 “Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.”

    Surah 9:14 “Fight them and Allah will punish them by your hands, lay them low, and cover them with shame. He will help you over them.”

    Surah 9:29 “Fight those who do not believe until they all surrender, paying the protective tax* in submission.” *protection tax is called the "jizyah" tax.

    Surah 9:123 “Fight the unbelievers around you, and let them find harshness in you.”

    Surah 47:4 “When you clash with the unbelieving Infidels in battle (fighting Jihad in Allah’s Cause), smite their necks until you overpower them, killing and wounding many of them. At length, when you have thoroughly subdued them, bind them firmly, making (them) captives. Thereafter either generosity or ransom (them based upon what benefits Islam) until the war lays down its burdens. Thus are you commanded by Allah to continue carrying out Jihad against the unbelieving infidels until they submit to Islam.”


    Those who know nothing of Islam pretend that Islam counsels against war. Those who say this are witless. ~Ayatollah Khomeini
    Bukhari:V3B48N826 “The Prophet said, ‘Isn’t the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?’ The women said, ‘Yes.’ He said, ‘This is because of the deficiency of a woman’s mind.’”

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    Islamism is not a global threat. It is a movement fueled by a majority of extremists in a need to fulfill the enjoyment they share and crave openly in killing men, woman and children - an extreme obsession they satisfied only by extreme terror.

    The only ones at threat are those Muslims and Islamics who are not extremists, who don't have to satisfy the need of self-gratification from others blood. Now if we could only tell who's who. Hmmm....

    To "plead for the universality of freedom of expression so that a critical spirit may be exercised on all continents, against all abuses and all dogmas" is waste of breath. Its nothing more then an ideological illusion that fuels a debate for intellectuals who own self fulfilling need is satisfied by using words that end in "ism" "ical" and "esto".

    The manifesto - "Against extremism in islam": Its entertaining for some, a waste of broadband for others, an orgasmic delight of intellectual pleasures for most.

    Me? I wondering how much broadband I used up downloading it.

  8. #8
    Senior Member RoadClosed's Avatar
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    It is a movement fueled by a majority of extremists in a need to fulfill the enjoyment they share and crave openly in killing men, woman and children - an extreme obsession they satisfied only by extreme terror.
    And it is that extremism that holds a vast power over the world of Islam.
    West of House
    You are standing in an open field west of a white house, with a boarded front door.
    There is a small mailbox here.

  9. #9
    MANIFESTO: Together facing the `new totalitarianism'
    Mar. 2, 2006. 01:00 AM

    After having overcome fascism, Nazism, and Stalinism, the world now faces a new totalitarian global threat: Islamism.
    What about Americanisim? "secular values for all."... right, for all except muslims? How is it a global strugal if it is only two classes? Democrats VS theocrats isn't what I would call a global strugal for universal values.

    Islamism is nurtured by fears and frustrations.
    Do you seriously mean Islam or do you mean terrorisim? Your signature says: Experience is a wonderful thing. It enables you to recognize a mistake. In my opinion, you should get more experience. I realize the author is banned but I wanted to reply anyway.
    “The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy.” - Martin Luther King, Jr.

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