Hardaway on Gays
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  1. #1
    Senior Member OverdueSpy's Avatar
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    Hardaway on Gays

    Ok. Now I really don't get this one. When asked about gay people Hardaway expressed his "opinion" and said:

    "You know, I hate gay people, so I let it be known," Hardaway said. "I don't like gay people and I don't like to be around gay people. I am homophobic. I don't like it. It shouldn't be in the world or in the United States."
    http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2766213

    Why is there such an outcry from the media over a basketball player's "opinion"? The last time I checked we are allowed freedom of speech...to a degree. I know that Hardaway is a "celebrity" and he shall be held accountable for his words, but if you take out the word "hate" and subsitute in "don't like" are his comments really that bad?

    If a straight male is supposed to be sensitive to the gay's sexual preference, and make allowances to accept gays within normal society, and turn their heads and pretend that nothing abnormal is occuring....then shouldn't the gay be sensitive to the homophobic's fear of an unexpected visit by the ether bunny, and make allowances to accept the homophobic's agressive display of masculinity, and pretend to be straight in order to "not" offend anyone's sensibilities?

    Personally I applaud Hardaway for at least being honest.

    Now go take you homophobic test!!@!!

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl.../etc/quiz.html

    63 - Your score rates you as "homophobic."
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  2. #2
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    There was a media outcry for the exact same reason that you had when you posted this here: everybody's got an opinion on it and feels the need to express it

    It's always the same pattern:

    1. Someone says something controversial
    2. Someone else (usually "the media") says something about it
    3. Yet someone else mentions that there is such a thing as free speech, then immediately forgets that they just said that and wonder why there is a media outcry (as if that's not a perfect example of free speech)

    I'm not sure what you don't get... The media outcry? Didn't you just say that there's such a thing as freedom of speech? Or is it the fact that you can get blasted for saying that you hate gays (just like you can get blasted for saying you like gays, of course)?

  3. #3
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    Well, as the old saw goes, I disagree with his opinion, but will defend his right to hold and express it. It doesn't bother me one way or another if someone is gay, as long as he doesn't try to stick his tongue in my mouth. But that is molestation/sexual harassment/assault upon my person, and that is a whole different ballgame. It's a personal lifestyle choice and homosexuals should be allowed to live their lives, just like everyone else. As long as the relationship is consensual, I don't care if two hermaphrodites are getting it on....

    Cheers,
    cgkanchi

    Oh, and 25 - Your score rates you as "high-grade non-homophobic."
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  4. #4
    AO übergeek phishphreek's Avatar
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    I thought the whole thing was hysterical! I may not like what he has to say or even agree what he says... but I'll defend his right to say it. I don't think he was wrong for saying it. If it pisses some people off, who cares. You can't please all the people all the time. If anything, I'm glad he was "keeping it real" and not faking it. He was asked for his opinion, was he not? It's not like he just started out ranting on gays. He was specifically asked for his opinion.

    Mind you, I don't share his opinion. I associate with several people (both friends and family) that are gay. It doesn't bother me in the slightest. Then again, I'm not religious either. For some reason, I've associated gay bashing with religious folk. "Because the bible says!" I don't give a F what the bible says. It was written by man (too many "interpreters") and man is fallible. BTW: I'm not bashing on religious people here. I'm just sharing my point of view. If you don't agree... good.

    10 - Your score rates you as "high-grade non-homophobic."
    Last edited by phishphreek; February 17th, 2007 at 01:08 AM.
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  5. #5
    Senior Member nihil's Avatar
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    Well,

    Apart from the question of "who gives a damn about his opinion?", I think it is pretty typical.

    It is the macho "jock" image that seems to be prevalent in team sports?

    I think you would get very similar responses from football and hockey players?

    I think that the responses from athletes, golfers, tennis players and the like would be rather different?

    Just suggestions based on my experiences of active team sports in my younger days

  6. #6
    AO Security for Non-Geeks tonybradley's Avatar
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    {Mind you, I don't share his opinion. I associate with several people (both friends and family) that are gay. It doesn't bother me in the slightest. Then again, I'm not religious either. For some reason, I've associated gay bashing with religious folk. "Because the bible says!" I don't give a F what the bible says. It was written by man (too many "interpreters") and man is fallible. BTW: I'm not bashing on religious people here. I'm just sharing my point of view. If you don't agree... good.

    10 - Your score rates you as "high-grade non-homophobic."}


    You beat me, but I was still high-grade non-homophobic. I had a 15.

    The irony of religion, particularly Christianity, being used as the basis of passing judgment is that the bible also specifies not to pass judgment.

    Religion is a matter of convenience. Most only quote bible passages that help to rationalize the judgment they are passing. They don't seem quite as hung up on taking the rest of the book literally.

    Exodus 35:2 says that anyone who works on Sunday should be put to death

    Leviticus 25:44 says that it is OK to own both male and female slaves as long as you purchase them from neighboring nations (watch out Canadians and Mexicans)

    Leviticus 24:17 clearly outlines the death penalty- if you take the life of a human you shall be put to death

    When wishing to dole out punishment and pass judgment, many quote the Old Testament. That is fine if you are Jewish because it represents the sum total of your teachings. But, if you claim to be Christian, you have to take into account that the New Testament and the teachings of Jesus allegedly supercede the Old Testament.

    We no longer sacrifice goats on a burning alter- because Jesus died as the ultimate, one-time sacrifice.

    We no longer honor eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth, because Jesus said to forget that stuff and love thy enemy, turn the other cheek, etc.

    You can't take the bible literally. But, if you choose to try, take the whole thing literally. How can people ignore or disregard one passage, then quote the next as if it is an immutable law?

    All that being said- I am atheist. I take great interest however in the hypocricy and lack of logic on which all major religions seem to be founded and how those proclaiming to follow those religions only follow the tenets and passages that are convenient or fit with how they want to interpret the world.

  7. #7
    AO Security for Non-Geeks tonybradley's Avatar
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    {Well,

    Apart from the question of "who gives a damn about his opinion?", I think it is pretty typical.

    It is the macho "jock" image that seems to be prevalent in team sports?

    I think you would get very similar responses from football and hockey players?

    I think that the responses from athletes, golfers, tennis players and the like would be rather different?

    Just suggestions based on my experiences of active team sports in my younger days}


    I don't know what percentage of the population is alleged to be gay, but the homophobes are just in denial.

    The whole world operates on a don't ask / don't tell policy. I am sure that the homophobic community would be shocked to learn just how many men and women in the military, professional sports, public office, etc. are actually gay and just haven't come out because they know it would damage their career.

    It is all hypocricy anyway. The politicians of the "Religious Right" preach fire and brimstone while standing on the floor of Congress, then go home to have sex with their male intern or hire a prostitute for a back-alley quicky before heading home to the wife and kids.

    The "Religious Right" claim the moral high ground, but behind closed doors they are as immoral- or more so- than the rest of us.

    Hell- the poster child of the evangelical faith and very adamant anti-gay pastor, Ted Haggard, was having gay sex and doing meth in the back alleys. Jerry Falwell slept (sleeps) with prostitutes. Catholic priests are involved with homosexual pedophilia around the world. This is the moral compass of the "Religious Right"? These are the "leaders" people turn to in order to learn about their faith and gain enlightenment on how to be better people and lead better lives.

    The sheep need to stop following the wolves and just think for themselves.

  8. #8
    Senior Member nihil's Avatar
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    Tony old chap, I must disagree with you most strongly. Being anti-gay is not a religious thing.......... if you are gay and religious, you will not have any offspring and would be more than likely to donate your accumulated wealth to your church?


  9. #9
    Senior Member JPnyc's Avatar
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    Funny, I saw the Hardaway quote and what I read was, "I'm an idiot. I'm a moron with a grossly inflated view of my own value. In a truly civilized nation, I would be neutered before I can procreate".

    Granted, I may be reading between the lines a bit.

  10. #10
    AO Security for Non-Geeks tonybradley's Avatar
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    {Tony old chap, I must disagree with you most strongly. Being anti-gay is not a religious thing.......... if you are gay and religious, you will not have any offspring and would be more than likely to donate your accumulated wealth to your church?}

    I don't mean to imply the 2 are inextricably linked. It was more a tangent sparked by what phishphreek said that sparked my anti-religious rhetoric.

    Certainly, there are those who call themselves religious who are also tolerant of alternative lifestyles, and there are those who are not religious and are still homophobic for some other reason (or lack thereof).

    I was simply pointing out that those who do cling to biblical scripture as the basis for their close-minded ignorance are doing so hypocritically because it is a book of parables and fables- good stories, some with good morals- but not to be taken literally. Or, if you want to try to take it literally, take the whole thing literally and not just those chapters and verses that back your close-minded ignorance.

    Not sure about your other points. Many gay couple do adopt or 'acquire' children through some means and have the same sort of nuclear family unit as a heterosexual couple. But, I am not sure that those gay couples without children are any more or less likely than heterosexuals to tithe their income to a religious institution, particularly when most religious institutions consider their lifestyle an immoral abomination.

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