Violence over Art?

Hey Hey,

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DISCLAIMER:

I seldom post here anymore. I used to post more in Cosmos than anywhere else, however my Anti-American sentiments almost lead to me being banned from this site. Anyways, this is probably old news, however I just read it this evening/morning and I'm outraged. You may see my Anti-Americanism stand out here, so that's been your warning... now on with the post.

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So I'm browsing around kuro5hin.org and I see this headline:

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Art Against Iraq Abuse Earns Black Eye

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Off that article there was a link to Zeke's Gallery @ Blogspot which contains a picture of an innocent art gallery owner with a black eye.

Off of this blog, there is a link to Arts + Action : SF Bay Area Indymedia. This website has photos, videos, and articles. There is also a picture of the painting in question.

Now that I've given you information, time for my post. This is absolutely outrageous. I find it hard to believe that a society can be so brainwashed, so uncultured and uncouth. This woman was spat on, punched in the face and her children had their lives threatened. I'm asking any American who reads this to explain this... This is a prime example of why the world hates the US. The general census is nothing more than a bunch of bloody savages, I'm surprised many of you don't eat your young. I almost said urinate in the street, but people do that everywhere.

The SFPD just told her to close the business? I dunno but last time I checked here if you recieved a death threat, the cops would protect you, or at least find out who did it. I recieved a death threat from a fellow employee once, he was restrained until the police arrived, charged and held in lock-up for 24 hours, before being released with warning to stay away from me.

I was finally started to accept that Americans are people just like everyone else, now I'm starting to wonder. I realize it isn't all of you, and that many of you are really great people. Hell I have several American friends from AO and other places. However your masses make you all look like a group of ignorant, mindless slobs. It seems to me that America needs a nice bout of genocide. Get rid of the political powers and the majority of these lower class savages and it'd actually be a nice place to visit.

If any brain washed American drones visit this website, I'd really love to hear you attempt to justify your fellow American's actions. Those of you who are intelligent and American that visit this site, I'd love an explanation of the actions of these retards (I'm sorry, but there's really no other word) that live next to you.

Anyways, I hope this disturbs everyone else as much as it disturbs me. Freedom of speech has been removed, so has protection from police... next they'll be vigilante justice and then anarchy. Although anarchy would probably provide more civility than Bush currently provides.

Peace,
HT

Try not to think of it as violence. Think of it as a kind of kinetic art form
When I punch you in the eye, I am only expressing myself.
You see, here in the USA we are very liberal in our definition of art

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&i...an+art+form%22

HT,

Just like any other country, America also has those few people who will go and do something like this. The same exact thing happens in canada and in across the globe. The problem is that here, in the US, everything is given way too much media attention, something that you don't see in Canada for example. It is election time, so you ill find in the media pretty much anything that has to do with Iraq one way or the other. Irresponsible journalism and very ignorant liberal journalists plague the media in the US. Just because some redneck who needs to cut his mullet does something stupid, doesn't mean he represents any particular part or group of people in the US.

my 2cents

the press is blowing it out of proportion and the press has caused it to happen. after a few notes left on the gallery door and some eggs thrown at her window she removed the painting from the front window. she said she was just trying to sell art, not make a political statement, which would have been the end of story but the press picked it up as if it were a current issue and did some rable rousing. tempers are high, its a sensative issue so its not too hard to find a few on the edge. the police suggested that she close the gallery until it blows over NOT shut the gallery down.

how does this differ from what happened with the visit of Jean-Marie Le Pen in england, or the way people react anywhere when a focal point is made of an issue that is hot. do you think it more outragous because its over a painting? ive sold a couple of paintings. if i were to do one of you having anal intercourse with a moose or a member of your family in some compromising situation would you call it art and not be offended if it were done in a painterly way then placed in the front window of a highly visable gallery? besides many of our young should be eaten.

now if you really want to see a shining example of american spirit. there's a man with a bulldozer somewhere in colorado...correction there was a man with a bulldozer in GRANBY, Colo...

Hey Hey,


For those of you wondering about the Granby Comment by Tedob1, I believe he was refering to this http://www.canoe.ca/NewsStand/Winnip...05/486644.html, which makes Americans look even worse.

You can sit there and say this happens all over the world, but it doesn't. The US bulldozer incident is a prime example. When's the last time you heard about someone jumping in a bulldozer and going on a rampage here in Canada... or in most other parts of the world for that matter.

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ive sold a couple of paintings. if i were to do one of you having anal intercourse with a moose or a member of your family in some compromising situation would you call it art and not be offended if it were done in a painterly way then placed in the front window of a highly visable gallery?

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I'd be honoured to be featured in art. I may be somewhat offended, but that's my right, I'm in the picture. Joe McViolent walking down the street has no right to be offended by it.

Now back to my comments on this topic.

Suggesting even to close the gallery until it blows over is repulsive. That's horrible police work. If the cops said that to me and I was getting death threats, I'd start killing off police officers, until I finally got some that wanted to do their job, rather than have people who have no interest in doing their job. I thought cops were supposed to protect and serve... doesn't sound like they did either of those things in this case.

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Just like any other country, America also has those few people who will go and do something like this. The same exact thing happens in canada and in across the globe. The problem is that here, in the US, everything is given way too much media attention, something that you don't see in Canada for example. It is election time, so you ill find in the media pretty much anything that has to do with Iraq one way or the other. Irresponsible journalism and very ignorant liberal journalists plague the media in the US. Just because some redneck who needs to cut his mullet does something stupid, doesn't mean he represents any particular part or group of people in the US.

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In the US it's not a few people, it's like half the population and that's what bothers me. You can blame the media all you want, but why not blame the people doing it? It is news, whether you think it is or not and that is why it's reported. You hear stuff about Iraq because your politians mention it, your media mentions it, and everyone else mentions it. If the general public was intelligent enough to say, "Hey we don't belong over there, it's none of our ****ing business" then the politicians would see that and focus on other topics, and then the media would be forced to divert there attention, other than reports of the news you all are currently still making... stuff like... a handful of American soldiers died today while slaughtering 1000s of innocent Iraqi civilians. You know the kind *******ish stuff your "soldiers" (I prefer the term cowards) do over there. However that's a whole other can of worms, that I don't feel like opening. My last comment would be how do you know about Canadian news? I sure as hell know you don't get it down in the US... I've spent time down there. Our news covers what's happening be it murders, a guy driving over a gas pump (was humerous to see), and whatever else. We just don't act on our news.

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how does this differ from what happened with the visit of Jean-Marie Le Pen in england,

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That was a political protect... against a person who has basically said they want to close borders to immigration. As much as I want to see this happen in Canada, I realize it's supposed to be a bad thing, and most people are against it. It was a political protect based against his party, those actions I can see. The day he became a politician and made remarks of those sort he started asking for those kind of actions... protesters, when in masses, end up doing some stupid things but that's because they don't share the same political views and don't want to see said changes made.

This differ's greatly from the incident in SF. She was an art gallery owner, not a politician. She was displaying art, not saying she wanted to change these rules about the country. She took it down and the attacks still continued. You say tempers were high, there was no need for tempers to be high.... that's nothing more than an excuse. These people were violent, sadistic animals who had no need to get angry in the first place, they just wanted to have some fun.

The general populous of America frightens me. Somedays I'd rather deal with Bush, than most of your civilians... and that says I lot since I'd kill Bush on sight if I had the chance (waits for the FBI, or CIA, or whatever the new US squad is that's been started to kill those who express freedom of speach). The US (not your politicians... everyone needs to stop blaming the politicians for these kinda things, same with the media... blame the politicians for tax hikes and **** like that... don't blame them because you are violent), anyways, The US reminds me of a caged bull. You sit there, kicking up dirt and causing a commotion and you get angry because of it. Then as soon as you get a chance to run you don't... you attack someone out of anger instead.

A buddy of mine once offered me 50K USD to go down and work in a Data Centre he ran. I laughed... I couldn't picture myself living in the US. While you have your share of intelligent people... you have way to many stupid ones to offset the few who are intelligent.

Peace,
HT

come on HT! your link really doesnt do justice to yankee ingenuity. this was built by one man in a garage. the entire nation of france cant do it as well

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040605/D830SQHG0.html

"It looked like a futuristic tank," said Rod Moore, who watched the dozer rumble past within 15 feet of his auto garage and towing company.

Trainor said the dozer's armor plates consisted of two sheets of half-inch steel with a layer of concrete between them.

Grand County Commissioner Duane Daley said Heemeyer apparently used a video camera and two monitors found inside to guide the dozer. Two guns were mounted in front and aimed through portals. Other portals were cut in the back.

It was unclear how many guns were found with Heemeyer. Authorities speculated Heemeyer he may have used a homemade crane found in his garage to lower the armor hull over the dozer and himself.

The buildings <damaged> included the cement plant, a utility company, a bank, a newspaper office, a hardware store and warehouse, the home of former Mayor L.R. "Dick" Thompson and the municipal building, which also housed a library.

Crumpled patrol cars and service trucks lay in the dozer's path. A pickup was folded nearly in half and had been rammed through the wall of a building.

Town manager Tom Hale said Heemeyer was angry after losing a zoning dispute that allowed a cement plant to be built near his muffler shop.

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your not entirly wrong, so yes be afraid. be very afraid. you dont know how lucky the world is to be dealing with president bush. there are many amoung the general population that still think we should "turn the sand to glass". lets not forget your dealing with some of the more intelligent americans here (self not included)

personally i also would like to see our boarders closed and return the statue of liberty to the french via cargo planes at thirty thousand feet. id like to see our troops pulled out of every nation in the world then using only half the money we are now build the most deadly armed force the world will EVER see. do nothing with it but mind our own friggen buisness. im not saying this is an intelligent solution but thats what id like to see.

about the news from canada. i dont hear that much. im now hearing about a deadly infection spreading threw hospitals immune to antibiotics but thats unusual its normally just the occasional attack on jewish temples.

HT: In all honesty.....

The First Amendment gives you the right to say anything you please.... Unfortunately, it doesn't give you the right to be heard, listened to, accepted, or reacted to..... It simply gives you the right to say what you want.

Freedom of speech comes with some responsibility and intelligence. If you know that you are putting something out "in the faces" of people that will not like it then you should probably think twice about putting it in "their face". The First Amendment allows a black man to walk into a bar full of rednecks and tell them that they are a bunch of stupid honkey bastards whose mothers prefer.... Well, you know...... It doesn't legislate the possible reaction.

This lady placed a picture out there in full view of "the world". A picture that she had to know would offend many in the current situation. Just because it's "art" doesn't reduce the potential for offense to others. Art is not sacrosanct.... You can say that art should be separated from politics etc. but it isn't.... As long as artists try to make political statements with their "art" then the political inference will be seen in it. Remove the political statements from the art and make it inoffensive.... make it _art_ and situations like this would disappear.

But this didn't happen... She didn't think clearly about the possible implications.... She probably agreed with the underlying political statement..... But she still knew that the display of such "art" would result in a visceral reation from some..... She chose to ignore that potential, probably for fiscal reasons, (she wanted to sell it or draw people into the gallery). Either way she made a bad decision......

Is violence against her right? No, obviously..... But you seem to be castigating Americans and making it sound like the police don't give a rats azz it's unfair..... There's a million people that would call for 24/7 police protection in Canada and the US.... It's not doable.... period.

What is doable is being responsible and intelligent with your First Amendment rights.....

This would not have happened had she chosen to place the painting at the back of the gallery and put something else in the front window...... She "made a bed"..... She ended up lying in it.... She thought it would make her money.... She paid the price of freedom...... It isn't "free".....

Hey Hey

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Is violence against her right? No, obviously..... But you seem to be castigating Americans and making it sound like the police don't give a rats azz it's unfair..... There's a million people that would call for 24/7 police protection in Canada and the US.... It's not doable.... period.

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Sure a million people may call for it but this is a case where it's needed. The police really didn't seem to give a "ratz azz." When Somone receives death threats, has children who receive death threats, is spit on and assaulted you don't just say close the shop. You protect that person; regardless of what everyone thinks, that's their job. I realize that this is a problem with police officers everywhere. They're nothing more than arrogant, lazy bastards. However my opinions on cops could fill a thread, they are the lowest form of life and should all be killed of.

However, I still say that the violence against her was ridiculous, just as this muffler shop managers actions were ridiculous. There's no need for any of this and my comments were that Americans jump to violence way to quickly to solve their problems. I'm ashamed to be a neighbour to the US. I guess it makes sense though. America likes to bully weaker countries, and American citizens like to bully others who are weaker then they are.

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The First Amendment allows a black man to walk into a bar full of rednecks and tell them that they are a bunch of stupid honkey bastards whose mothers prefer.... Well, you know...... It doesn't legislate the possible reaction.

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That comment doesn't help either. All it shows is that you have even more stupid, ignorant Americans that rely on violence.

I'm not just some random Canadian who hates Americans, although let me say most Canadians I know dispise Americans. I've spent much time across the northern states. I grew up in view of Michigan and spent 19 years there. I've spent weekends in cities across Michigan, Wisconsin, Ohio and Minnesota. I've seen first hand the hot-headed arrogance of American youth. Most of your teenagers should be taken out back with a paddle and had some respect beaten into them. They come to Canada and do nothing but pick fights, thinking they are better than everyone else. How about when you spend a night in a tourist section of a city and the front desk clerk at the hotel tells you to stay in after dark because it's not safe.

American is a violent land, and the rest of the world realizes it. It's time for you to realize it and do something about it.

Peace,
HT

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You protect that person; regardless of what everyone thinks, that's their job. I realize that this is a problem with police officers everywhere. They're nothing more than arrogant, lazy bastards. However my opinions on cops could fill a thread, they are the lowest form of life and should all be killed of.

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I for one hope they'll all live happily ever after!

A while ago, my wife got a speeding ticket from a cop (she was speeding, no matter what she's going to reply in this thread :D) while driving home (probably couldn't wait to see me).
A couple hours later, one of our boys (2.5 years old) managed to "escape" from the house (communications-problem... door not locked... little boogie walks out the door). A hell of a lot of panic, the entire neighborhood looking for him... I spot a cop driving down the neighborhood, run up to him, and tell him the story. He immediately starts looking (after saying to my wife: "yes, it's me from this morning"), and calls in seven other units. Long story short: one of our neighbors finds him after a while (playing with those flags they plant to mark gas-lines, a couple houses down), the one cop radios it in for those seven other units (all on their way, sirens, lights, everything). Cop says he's glad we found him, tells us to definitely call 911 next time it happens, and that they don't take stuff like that lightly.

Anyways: if you don't like cops, you must be on the wrong side of law :D

And btw: 90% of Americans are ignorant, stupid, arrogant, and obnoxious. Just like 90% of Canadians, Belgians, and Nigerians are.

Damn Neg and I got a 89% on that ignorant test. I was hoping they graded it on a curve. :p
HTRegz, you are ashamed to be a neighbour of the US? Come on man, what the hell does that mean? Are you that insecure?
As far as that customized bulldozer, give the guy some credit for ingenuity. And you keep on talking about how violent Americans are, but whats up with you wanting to kill cops and the president?
I think we all want to hear about how perfect Canada is, or at least I do.