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I have been following this story for a while......
Its amazing the accomplishments and changes that can happen when people stand for what they believe in.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/n...nd/4349963.stm
5 sisters standing up not only to the government...but to the IRA
For change
I can only see it as positive.
MLF
Ahh yes... Generally Sinn Fein is not to be taken lightly....
Have been folowing the story myself. Courageous people.
Yes very brave.
I believe thay have already made great strides...and even with the threats have a chance on breaking the stifling control the IRA and church have on them.
I have never understood the inbred hated in Ireland...passed on from generation to generation.
Or the control the religion has??
Is it just ignorance??
MLF
Gerry Adams was the "President" of the Provisional IRA Council in Dublin in the early 80's. Martin McGuinness was the Second in Command at the same time.... This means they knew of, ordered and monitored IRA operations during that period.
How do I know? I was there, at the time, as an Intelligence "Operative" with access to a computer system that... errr... doesn't exist. It was called an "official secret" and the Brits here know what that means for anyone who signs the Official Secrets Act.... I'm pretty sure that the fact we track people by computer is "out of the bag" now... ;)
The information available to me was extensive and conclusive. At the same time the fledgling "Sinn Fein" was starting their "political" aspirations Gerry Adams was it's head.... While he was head of the PIRA Council... There is no doubt.... I saw the evidence/intelligence. He made that move for power... Nothing else... just power.
This is not the first time the IRA/Sinn Fein have been "stood up to"... There was a pair of ladies that tried it in the late 80's... Sadly I forget their names.... Mairead was one IIRC....
The facts: Sinn Fein is a POS, the PIRA and now the RIRA, (IIRC what they call themselves today), are the same. They have always been a bunch of thugs.... Now, don't get me wrong here... The UDA, UFF etc. were a bunch of thugs too.... I remember reading what they did to a working man in Belfast who's only crime was working in a low end job but getting two or three of his girls into Queens University in Belfast, (utterly remarkable for the environment they lived in, Divis Flats), who was taken into a back alley, had his teeth removed with pliers and then beaten to death..... for being a Catholic...
I wish these ladies the absolute best of luck and I hope that they can provide a resistance that grows.... It's the only way to beat them....
In short... Terrorists are Terrorist.... No matter what their "point" may be.... they are useless thugs and criminals that need exterminating.....
Questions?
Don't beat around the bush Tiger. Tell it like it is, no more sitting on the fence :DQuote:
they are useless thugs and criminals that need exterminating.....
The other details coming out make for poor reading.
THere was a Sinn Fein member IN the Pub, when the murder took place.......
The Pub was full of people, NONE of whom have come forward / seen or said ANYTHING.......
Northern Ireland is a VERY strange place. The hatred is inbuilt from birth, and it was kept on the boil during the 'troubles' by the Protestants burning down the Catholic houses in THEIR area, and the Catholics burning down the Protestant houses in THEIR area ???????
As for the worst place in ALL of Northern Ireland / Belfast - the Divis flats HAS to be in the top two, along with anywhere in County Armagh.
Just my thoughts ...........
What I wanted to stress on posting this is that these women are going about it without the histrorical thuggishness (is that a word??)..and that they are standing up against it.
TS/.....I believe you were talking about Mairead Corrigan...winner of the Nobel Peace Prize
http://nobelprize.org/peace/laureate...rrigan-cv.html
I just wish these women and thier families a safe journey.
They are very brave..to be standing up to these people...as we can see not many others have thier gaul..They have been held down and brainwashed for far too long by the IRA and church
I agree with you Tiger...terrorist are terrorists...no ifs ands or buts about it
one thing that did move me was the speech made by Catherine McCartney...
on how the American Irish should stop the romanticing the IRA and the struggle of Northern Ireland
Being of Irish heritage myself...I am guilty of this is my younger days.
I am much older now :( and wiser..I hope
.....I can see the inbred hated and bigority that drives this...on both sides...and want no part of it. I would like to see the McCartney Sisters make a change
I am grateful I live in such a tolorant society like Canada.
One thing I hate though (and hate is a strong word)...is when other cultures bring this thier inbred, handed down hate and bigority here......and I am not just talking about Catholics and Protestants.......if you know what I mean
MLF
I'm half Irish myself. My family is Daily/Quinlain on my mothers side. My middle name is even an old root name in gaelic of one of the clans.
That being said, and having been born, bred, and raised in America, I really don't understand the root of these problems and 'the troubles'. I understand some generalities, I think. The protestant british settlers are in place (for generations now) and the catholic irish feel they have been (wrongly) supplanted and uprooted by said protestants. Now that is probably Sinn Fein spin, or worse. I don't really know the cause. But I do know it's lead to a state where people are targets for seemingly random violence based solely on how they say grace at meals, or what place of worship the attend.
It sounds frighteningly sad, and scary. I know both sides are very certain of their 'rightfulness' and the 'evil oppression' of the other.
I wish I understood better, but it's not a subject that mainstream America hears much about, outside of Tom Clancy movies.
I think the issues go way back...Ireland has always had "invaders".....back to the vikings which have roots there along with the british...and are long time bred into the society..we all have varied roots nowadays
I think the origins of the IRA go back to fighting the "Black and Tans" who were brutes .......
Anyway that was along time ago......and many things have changed since then.
I just like that these women are standing up to the oppressive parties\groups....and making waves in the world media.....annd hopefully making a change in the thinking of the youth of Northern Ireland... and to question the issues....
..and not cowering to the "threats" from the current brutes......whether they be catholics, protestants, the church or their own government.......
From what I can see they are threading on dangerous ground...and couragously at that.....braver than those other 70 odd people in the bar that witnessed or helped in the brutal beating\stabbing\killing of thier brother
All the power to them!!!!
MLF
I might as well join the club...as I've mentioned in previous threads my ancestery is Irish/Scotish...A Kelt from a long line of Kelts...
and I have studied many historical documents on the history of the Islands and their people...if memory serves me correct and it's been awhile so I may be wrong as new information unfolds with historians...the Irish are actually the original inhabitants of what is now Portugal who were forced out by invaders around 2000BC and sailed north to what is now Ireland where they, in turn, forced the original inhabitants of Ireland north and across the waters into what is now England, the original inhabitants of Ireland were then again forced north through the invasions of Romans, Normans, Saxons, Anglos, and many others...the original inhabitants were the Picts which were called such because when Ceasar invaded he called them Picts because they shaved themselves clean and painted their bodies blue ( according to his own records...I know many people deplict the Picts as tattooed ladies at a circus...but according to Ceasars own accounts they did not have tattoos they were painted blue and had no hair except on their head...they shaved their body hair )...
my point being...that Ireland has no more legitimate claim to Northern Ireland than the American Indian has claim to the U.S.
Most borders are fixed through war and are maintained through defense...if they ( the Official Government of Ireland ) want the land back they stole in the first place from it's original inhabitants they should declare war...or try to annex it through peaceful means.
The IRA are just a bunch of terrorists ! I doubt very much the U.S. would tolerate some radical Indian movement that bombed cafe's and cars in downtown Chicago.
Having been in the USA for some 16 years now I have come across the "Irish-Americans" on a few occasions.... Two notables were as follows:-
On vacation in Baltimore I visited a victualling establishment. My ex had walked in before me and was already at the bar ordering when I walked in. As soon as I entered my hair stood up. The walls were filled with amatuer paintings of Pigs, (the British military Humber(?)), and Makrilons, (the armored Land Rovers), on fire or being blown up by terrorists with RPG7's. Taking pride of place in the center behind the bar was a large B/W photograph of Bobby Sands, (the IRA terrorist in the H Blocks that starved himself to death, (Daily Mirror Slimmer of the Month for 3 straight months IIRC)). I arrived at the bar as the beers arrived.... I told the barkeep that I wouldn't drink in his establishment which drew the attention of the locals.... :rolleyes:. We left with the barkeep yelling obscenities at me.
The second was at a Highland games in Bethlehem PA. There was this skinny little worm going around with some sort of support the IRA tee shirt on collecting money of all things. He was nearly smart - he had a much bigger guy with a similar tee shirt on as his "bouncer"... He asked me for money and I told him to.. er.. "disappear"... He then decided it would be fun to follow me around and _keep_ asking me to support the cause of the oppressed... His bouncer found this exceedingly funny until he made the mistake of getting a little too close to me.... :D I do believe that when I walked away he was crying.... The worm was certainly bleeding.... and my ex was mega pissed since we decided it was best to leave rather than be slapped with a lawsuit....
The problem here was caused by the Major media.... Their reporting was always slanted to the side of the IRA and always against the Brits. This helped foster an attitude that made giving money in collections to a terrorist organization really rather acceptable.
MLF... Yes Mairead Corrigan.... I remembered the Corrigan later.... Fine woman along with her friend who's name really escapes me....
Hopefully, while no-one there seems to have the balls to step forward and point the finger at the culprits, the IRA and Sinn Fein have taken sufficient bad press in the last 6 months not to be stupid enough to take reprisals against the McCartney family... It really would be the nail in their coffins and Adams is smart enough to know that... The order has almost certainly been put out already... "Hands Off!!!", and whether you believe he's still the head of the PIRA council or not - his words are law......