Ant-iAmerican-ism

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Originally posted here by Guus
To lots of americans, patriotism is almost a kind of religion, that scares me. Some people tend to abuse religions - that scares me even more.

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Well, the country is less than four hundred years old and is founded on a bunch of cultures and religions. I guess the lack of original "americanism" makes people stick together and defend their newly founded country with whatever they got.

The US as a concept is a rather interesting thing because it is the newest country based on european civilisation, yet it has completely taken over the world. American culture invade every part of our everyday life and kids in school gave up their english accent years ago in favour of the much cooler american accent as heard on tv.

I do however think that America is a truly magnificent nation in several different ways and I think the american way to celebrate freedom is healty. I enjoy the same freedom of speech and freedom of press as any american but I take my freedom for granted and I think it is dangerous to do so.

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Originally posted here by lord_darkside_x
... they responded with and i quote "If you hate our country so much, then why don't you leave." to which a few other coworkers agreed.

i was discussing with my mother, my policy on warfare (which i think should be avoided at all costs) and i made a statement about saying we shouldn't risk the lives of our troops in wars that don't concern us. she also responded with, "If you hate our country so much, then why don't you leave."

now please don't turn this thread into a discussion of the opinions in the examples for they are just examples. but is it just me or has any one else found this happening to them

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OK, I will not discuss the examples. Why is it that you can express yourself in ways that you are well aware will upset other people and then whine when they exercise their Constitutional rights and tell you things that in response that YOU don't like?

I may have have missed some posts, but I have NOT see anyone STARTING THREADS here saying that all people who say negative things they don't like about the U.S. should be deported. INSTEAD, I see people like you posting criticism of reactions from people that you have deliberately antagonized. Do you mean that you don't know your mother well enough to know that what you said about her country is hurtful to her? It is obvious to me that you deliberately said things to upset her and your co-workers. This has NOTHING to do with the U.S. - other than the fact that you have used criticism of your country as a way to irritate other people. When others say "then leave", are so dense as to not understand that the simply don't wish to discuss this any further? GROW UP!!!

Similar to the poster who thinks that (paraphrase) "you'll grow out it." I think that you have maturity problems. Anyone who deliberately antagonizes others then receives a rebuke and then whines about it later is someone who frankly needs a little ass whuppin'.

"Patriotism is not a short and frenzied outburst of emotion but
the tranquil and steady dedication of a lifetime."-Adlai E. Stevenson,Jr.

lorddarksidex
I didn't get the same answer as you did (If you hate our country so much, then why don't you leave.), because I'm not an american. I got it more like this way: "If you hate our country so much, then shut the hell up ******* and die". Well that's not really a problem to me and it also is more of an example of how far some people can go in their 'patriotism' and hatred.

dark, i get called unamerican all the time for practicing my freedom of speech. i know excactly what you are saying. some people's minds are so closed that they refuse to see the good in what you are saying.

i really fear that because of this whole 911 thing, we will soon be living in a police state. heck, a senator (cant remember which) recently stated that our country will not be much different from those countries we were fighting during wwII and vietnam if we continue to give up our freedoms so willingly in the name of "protection". just be careful, everyone. be aware of what laws are being passed.

It seems to me that no one should really want war. It's a bad thing, it's definitily a total loss of huimanity and civilization.

That said, I would also like to say what makes America great is that fact that we are the people are supposed to question our government's actions.

On the the flip side of that, being patriotic doesn't mean supporting all it's actions. I am an ex-military person and I for one don't like war, but some of the comments about America going after countries for the hell of it are not correct in my view.

The axis of evil thing is a stange concept I don't totally agree with, however if we sit back and do nothing it will come back to bite us. It has in the past and it will again. A proactive military is not something anyone wants - it's something we need.

I know that many people think that our policies are not the best, but if we were totally passive like in the early 1940's when France, England, Belgum, Holland, Polland and the like were being raped. We sat back and were passive, finally when we got in the war we made a difference. (A good difference) - It may happen again, maybe this time it will be America that is attacked or nuked or even invaded. Then everyone will be saying "why didn't the government do something about this before".

There needs to be a defining line between being zealous and patriotic. Patriotic people fight for what they believe in when the time is appropriate and don't overdo the whole national pride thing. Zealous patriots are the ones who scream the loudest about actions and protecting the nation and they're right out front with the flag-waving and whatnot. Problem is, all these 'patriotic' people fell out of the woodwork when 9/11 happened and everyone and their brother had flag bumper stickers and American pride stuff all over the place yet I question their real motivation. Personally, I think it's the whole 'opaque bubble' they lived in got busted and the real world showed up.

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Originally posted here by Zadok0552

I may have have missed some posts, but I have NOT see anyone STARTING THREADS here saying that all people who say negative things they don't like about the U.S. should be deported. INSTEAD, I see people like you posting criticism of reactions from people that you have deliberately antagonized. Do you mean that you don't know your mother well enough to know that what you said about her country is hurtful to her? It is obvious to me that you deliberately said things to upset her and your co-workers. This has NOTHING to do with the U.S. - other than the fact that you have used criticism of your country as a way to irritate other people. When others say "then leave", are so dense as to not understand that the simply don't wish to discuss this any further? GROW UP!!!

Similar to the poster who thinks that (paraphrase) "you'll grow out it." I think that you have maturity problems. Anyone who deliberately antagonizes others then receives a rebuke and then whines about it later is someone who frankly needs a little ass whuppin'.

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Whoa. Narrow minded thinking if you ask me.

In what way are lord_darksides's opinions antagonizing and what kind of people gets upset for the opinions he expressed? Seems to me there is a lacking of nuance in this debate and that when someone is trying to express something else they get told to move. It is undemocratic and totally against the freedom you so proudly hold before everybody.

The foundation of democracy are different views and the equal expression of them. If one side or one opinion is silenced democracy is thrown out the window.

You either tell lord_darkside_x to shut up and stand for the fact that you oppose your american freedom or you stand by his side for his right to express whatever is on his mind, wether you like it or not. That's what your freedom of speech is all about. Or maybe you just like it when people say what you think is appropriate?

I would even say that it is of uttermost importance in any democratic society to deliberatly toss in some inconvienient opinions into the discussions just to keep them going. A free democratic society demands debate. I can't stress this enough.`

Cheers,

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Just people practicing on of our American right's , Iwould say lord dark.I am against our country being involved in other countries war,s.But not against the death penalty. And thats why america is so great,we can express our views freely.Withour fear of being shot for it. I grew up during the vietnam era,so my views on war are going to be a tad different than the younger generation's are now.

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hmmmm...kent State anyone? seems like they were using your much vaunted freedom of speech.

To Who ever gave me some anti-points with the Comment:

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You don't even live in the US, so you have no right to bitch about the US. Besides, because of the US, the UK is NOT speaking German. Show some gratitude.

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I have no problem with people giving me Valid anti-points, but for a very bland post as i had done :confused:

Please have some courtesy and put your name against your comment. isnt standing up with your OWN viewpoint what it's all about in the end?



Thank you.

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Originally posted here by E-1

I have no problem with people giving me Valid anti-points, but for a very bland post as i had done :confused:

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I think the antipoint comment you received pretty much confirms part of what have been said in this discussion. There are people that belive it to be wrong to criticize the US.

I think criticism of any country at any given point is important. Criticizing people are thinking people.

Why can't people living outside the US criticize it? Give me just one reason.

Besides, because of the UK the US exists at all. There is a reason for americans speaking english. but maybe that never occured to whoever gave you your antipoints. ;p

Cheers,