actually road, what neg is reffering to is saudies being flown out at a time when all commerical flights were grounded.
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actually road, what neg is reffering to is saudies being flown out at a time when all commerical flights were grounded.
Yeah, I miss him as well. He used to be my "tag partner" in a Cosmos argument or political issue so to speak. Anyway's, AFAIK some of the Bin-Laden's still reside in America (dunno how or why) but they have completely denounced their brother and have given loads of money to victims' families and the American government (****, they pay taxes, so..).Quote:
ah i miss him being around why'd you have to bring that up bastard.
Neg, ya did bring up a good point about why the majority of them left and whatnot and also the point that it was mentioned before. You would figure the "most powerful country in the world" would look at the threat's more carefully, cautiously, and would actually consider them a legit threat (meaning the FBI/CIA would look at it and investigate it).
Road > Tedob is correct. Bush was offered the Presidential Daily Briefing on 08/06/01, only a little over a month before 9/11.
In 1998, a report was made about the possibility of Bin Laden hijacking airplanes, and that report was mentioned in the PDB.
Now, Clinton and Gore (if they ever even read that report) shouldn't have done anything, imo, since there's not much you can do about it (and there was no "real" data in it). Bush saw the same stuff in his 08/06 PDB, and again: I don't think there's anything he should have done, nor could have done.
That's not the problem, though... the problem is that Bush read about hijackers flying planes into buildings only a little over a month before 9/11 (or maybe he didn't, or maybe he didn't remember... can't really blame him). Someone wrote that PDB maybe a day before 08/06, and offfered it to Bush on 08/06. At least that someone should have said "Hey! I just put that in my PDB! And now it's really happened!". Again, I don't blame Bush for not remembering that PDB when he was informed of 9/11, but don't you think someone should have mentioned to him that he should have read about that only a little over a month ago in his PDB?
So: there is a PDB in August, stating that there are reports of Bin Laden (not just anyone, but BIN LADEN) wanting to fly airplanes into buildings. Only a little over a month later, the exact thing described in the PDB actually happens. DING DONG!
A couple of days later, the Saudi Government asks the US for assistance to safely escort Bin Laden's family out of the US, and that's what the problem is, imo... 24 of his family members get a safe exit out of the US while their last name is mentioned in that PDB only a little over a month earlier.
In the days/weeks following 9/11, over 1,000 people (mostly muslims) got detained for being suspected of having something to do with 9/11... but not the Bin Ladens? That's what doesn't make sense to me...
From what I've read, the Saudi Government wanted them out there asap, without them being identified, without them being interrogated. The FBI did identify most of them, but there was no time for serious interrogation because Washington went on its knees for the Saudis...
The US government isn't to blame for what happened on 9/11, but something went wrong right after 9/11. That PDB is the key factor, imo. And the pressure of the Saudi government...
If you all want to charge the bin laden family with what their brother/son/nephew has done, stop and think. If you have a brother who leaves home when he is 17, with some crazy ideas about murdering people in the name of your religion, and you completely break off all ties to him, and hear off and on from various sources that he is killing people, why should you be forced to stay in the country when he does something really crazy, radical, stupid, or all at once? The bin laden family has not had contact with their son for many years, but with americans the way they are (impulsive, stupid, believe everything on TV [MAJORITY of americans... think hicks with american flags everywhere and skynard blasting, not you guys, I am american too]) the instant they heard the name bin laden they would go after that family, and possibly cause them harm. If they would have been harmed, the saudi gov't would have been quite pissed eh? And where do we get a bunch of our oil from? It all leads down the the ching ching. $$$ mean almost everything anymore.
Neg, the Bin Laden's could have had something to do with 9/11 but I highly doubt it. For starter's, they denounced OBL and everything he was for, saying he "twisted the muslim religeon into a choke hold" at one point (which he does all the time IMO). Sure, they coulda been playing a role to help aide/assist the hijacker's and whatnot as well as OBL but that is also doubtful. Why would they give money to victim families, American government, NYPD/NYFD, etc etc if they were with them? 'Cause they could afford it? Who know's.. You make an excellent point and perhap's it should have been investigated further before shipping them out.Quote:
In the days/weeks following 9/11, over 1,000 people (mostly muslims) got detained for being suspected of having something to do with 9/11... but not the Bin Ladens? That's what doesn't make sense to me...
Another case in point is they went to Saudi Arabia and to my knowledge as well as the American Government's, are still there. Why go there (if they are with OBL) to a place where he is exiled and is banned? The Saudi's wanted them safe, yes.. not interrogated, yes. Because they are Saudi's and could be hurt/harmed if they stayed in America. The Saudi Government doesn't like OBL and that is pretty well known, so an alternate motive is unlikely.
Again, Neg you make a point. And they very well could have had something to do with it and possibly should have been interrogated. But for having the last name 'Bin Laden' isn't much a reason just for having a corrupt, insane, and terroristic brother.
EDIT: Yeah, I agree with basically everything The Grunt said. Well said man.
The Grunt > They've never even been decently questioned...
All they should've done is detained them until they were properly questioned. Wouldn't detention protect them from the anger of the masses? Question them decently, then put them on a plane back home.
In 2001, Mohammad Bin Laden (one of Osama's sons) got married. Osama was there. Osama's mother was there, at least two brothers and a sister were there...
Ah I see Tedob. My point still stands though. And what is the big deal outside of another Bush hating point? No secret the world kisses oil ass in the middle east. Besides; the coveted hero of the left says he did it. Not Bush. The 9/11 commission also makes no issue with it, and states it was appropriate despite Moore's website stating it's collaberation. No one ever argued it didn't happen?
Who authorized the flights I don't care about?
Quote:
In an interview with The Hill yesterday, Clarke said, “I take responsibility for it. I don’t think it was a mistake, and I’d do it again.”
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“It didn’t get any higher than me,” he said. “On 9-11, 9-12 and 9-13, many things didn’t get any higher than me. I decided it in consultation with the FBI.”
Now even if Bush did let them go, they were in constant investigation and surveilence so I can perhaps sleep at night and worry about other things? Of course there are still those who believe something fishy happened. That article has some quotes from democrats that still have concerns. Politics. ;)Quote:
The Sept. 11 commission released a statement last month declaring that six chartered flights that evacuated close to 140 Saudi citizens were handled properly by the Bush administration.
So what? That's Mohammad Bin Laden. Not Osama. Obviously, you'd figure the guy's (Mohammad) grandmother to be there as well as his sister's and brother's. Doesn't mean they like Osama, but he is the father and he does have a right to be at his son's wedding. Doesn't mean he went there to discuss/talk about plans for the attack or even go there for any reason other than the simple fact his son was getting married.Quote:
In 2001, Mohammad Bin Laden (one of Osama's sons) got married. Osama was there. Osama's mother was there, at least two brothers and a sister were there...
I know my family has one of them (most do) a member of the family that some view as the "outcast" that come's to the family event's but doesn't talk to everyone much. He/she just come's and goes because he/she is apart of the family. Could it not be the case here?
Sure that could be the case. It could be the opposite as well, though. See? There's doubt. Why? Because they didn't get questioned...
I agree that some form of questioning (whether minimal or a brief investigation) should have POSSIBLY been done. However a simple family marriage isn't really going to speculate to me that was their "meeting place" where the family planned with OBL.
It all goes back to what Cain said about Abel in the Bible:
Like I said, Neg you got a point. But just because one egg went bad, doesn't mean the lot of them are.Quote:
Am I my brother's keeper?