Only in California

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The people who're actually fussing about these immigrants coming forth and taking these 'bottom end' jobs are those who are either a - not motivated to improve themselves, or b - too stupid to improve themselves, or c - idiotic rednecks.

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Ok I agreed on your statements but this one I have to say something about! Well did you ever consider some people who have lost their job to -**cough**- bush, the war, terrorism, outsourcing.............and need those jobs? uhm? Yes of course A through C exists but the people who have lost their jobs that I have said before are also crying out! This is not only in our country::::

http://www.fpa.org/newsletter_info25...l%20Immigrants
http://edition.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/eu...n.illegals.02/

and so on! Also what disgusts me is the ignorance of some of these "new" immigrants- not knowing/learning/speaking English when needed! My father, when he came to this country, did not know how to speak an ounce of English but he learned and respected the truth that people didn't know his language. Another example is my chinese friend who, when I first meet didn't speak English, now speaks respectable. Working in my friends restaurant/at school/vacation etc many of these people expect you to speak their language and don't even try to reach a common ground! Of course this is not all of them but most! This reason most of all will degrade us overall! Just thoughts!

Kurt you bring up and interesting point. The same people who Bash bush, applaud the "doom" of the economy, wage war on outsourcing and complain about every thing possible.... support giving illegal immigrants drivers licenses, health care, welfare and the like. AND they call them UNDOCUMENTED WORKERS to twist their version of "newseak" upon us.

They don't come here and get rich and go back to their origins. And even when some do there are millions here, filling hospitals, driving cars without knowing how to read signs, and generally just pushing our culture aside. Hell some of us tried for decades to stop road blocks and a few of them get caught driving with NO license, NO insurance, and having NO visa or ANY documention of any kind on the road in cars and OMG, these checks have to be stopped imediately. **** Americans and their constitition. It's about the ability of illegals to go undetected that is important. I cannot support that.

So what is wrong with tightening a border and letting them in with proper identification and educating someone on how to drive before they get on the road with a car full of kids? And why to the mexican people continue to support corruption in their police and government. With all the money being made here and HUGE celebrities and business men who are extemely wealthy and hispanic, I don't see why it continues. Unless they as a people want it too.

I firstlined my previous post 'stranger than fiction' for a reason. I'm a conservative. I usually vote independent, but in this election I'm backing Bush. Yet for all the conservatism in me I can't see a reason to keep fighting illegal immigration. Ok, they pack up cars and ignore our laws, fail to learn our language and fill our hospitals. Let's address these one at a time, shall we?

Packing up cars and ignoring our traffic laws - eventually they get caught and deported, or caught and jailed if the traffic offense merits it, then deported after. It's a heftier price than you pay for running a stopsign or speeding now isn't it? Let's add to that by saying that in paying whatever fines they're awarded for such recklessness, they're contributing to our community, yet they can never draw from our social programs to reap the benefits. (read my bit on income tax and social security - same thing)

Fail to learn our language - I have to agree absolutely on that. If folks are going to live here, let them please learn to speak American. We don't ask for perfect english, but at least enough to qualify at the 'stupid redneck' level... Amazingly enough, most countries do teach english in their public school systems. Does this mean we're receiving the dregs from them?

Filling our hospitals - I'm curious if you've looked at the large number of uninsured American citizens that fill our hospitals these days? Amazingly enough, as many as 4 of 5 people visiting ER's in the US are uninsured, and have no means to pay. This burdens up the rest of us by causing the hospitals to attempt to recoup their costs by overbilling those of us who are insured - upping our insurance premiums in the process. It's my huge argument for socialized medicine that cannot be shot down - (yes, I still oppose that but that's completely offtopic). Back to our immigrants - The neighborhood I lived in prior to my recent move was mostly hispanic. Of my neighbors, I counted exactly two that were US citizens. The neighborhood was clean, well kept, and free of crime. Children didn't fear to walk the sidewalks or play outside, nor did their parents fear for them. Those who lived there paid their bills, paid their (reasonably high) rent on time, and rarely had economic problems. I couldn't have asked for better neighbors, other than the language barrier (since I speak a small amount of Spanish, and a few of them spoke some American, even this was overcome).

You say they say '**** Americans and their constitution' yet they come here for the better way of life. Dude, it's the old story about the Irish immigrant of the 1910's coming over, getting a job sweeping streets, and building an empire. Same tale, just different main characters in it. There was a time when we didn't patrol our borders, when anyone who wanted to come here and had the means to get here was welcomed to pursue the American Dream on their own. "Give us your tired, your poor, your huddled masses." This same ideology could and should be applied today. Were it not for the corruption in their own country's government, I'm quite sure the Mexican territories would have applied for statehood years ago. Puerto Rico has, has been refused, and still continually applies. The last time they were shot down was because someone in Congress argued that the 51 stars would look awkward on our flag. Someday I hope they succeed.

Kurt - agreed, there are some who've lost their jobs for whatever reason... I hope the ex-Enron execs are happy at MacDonald's because nobody else would hire them, or an illegal immigrant got their jobs. In the meantime, I hope our society of displaced workers trains harder, learns more, smartens up quite a bit, and gets a better job for which an illegal immigrant cannot qualify.

Let's do away with all political borders. Adioas, See ya, I am off to find a flat in Amsterdam. Oooh better yet a boat house on a secluded canal. :)

I didn't say anything about people coming here with the **** American comment. I say that me, along with other groups have tried for 10 years or so to get the courts to put some limitations on how and when cops can arbitrarily stop people for NO REASON, other than they are on the road during a holiday. THEN, out of the blue some illegals get caught and BAM the courts stop it. ??????? So it makes me say what the hell is happening here. As for the Irish imigrant... to my knowledge they didn't sneak in and NOT process through imigrations. As stated, do that your my brother. All I am asking is "hey muchachos", get a green card man. No green cards? Please wait, if people stop comming here illegally perhaps there will be a million more green cards to pass around eh....

It's not the same tale. It's a new one. If you get in a car, at least have a drivers license some education and be able to READ. As for all the other arguments... put back some taxes into the economy that supports you.

I didn't think the peurto ricans wanted state hood? I'll look into that. The are a US territory though with US issued passports, Citizenship and congressional delegates. I'll look into congressional archives.

Please note my difference between a legal alien and one who is not here by legal means and posess no form of Identification.

Peace

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..yet they come here for the better way of life.

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Is that the honest truth or the media's words? Not downing your argument |3lack|ce, just something to ponder!

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Let's do away with all political borders. Adioas, See ya, I am off to find a flat in Amsterdam. Oooh better yet a boat house on a secluded canal.

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lol. I'll go to some place in the German Alps that is only reachable by trail.

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Originally posted here by kurt_der_koenig
Ok I agreed on your statements but this one I have to say something about! Well did you ever consider some people who have lost their job to -**cough**- bush, the war, terrorism, outsourcing.............and need those jobs? uhm? Yes of course A through C exists but the people who have lost their jobs that I have said before are also crying out! This is not only in our country::::

http://www.fpa.org/newsletter_info25...l%20Immigrants
http://edition.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/eu...n.illegals.02/

and so on! Also what disgusts me is the ignorance of some of these "new" immigrants- not knowing/learning/speaking English when needed! My father, when he came to this country, did not know how to speak an ounce of English but he learned and respected the truth that people didn't know his language. Another example is my chinese friend who, when I first meet didn't speak English, now speaks respectable. Working in my friends restaurant/at school/vacation etc many of these people expect you to speak their language and don't even try to reach a common ground! Of course this is not all of them but most! This reason most of all will degrade us overall! Just thoughts!

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Here, here!!!

<rant> I couldn't have said it better, Thank you. I also have to give Roadclosed some credit here as well. Let them in legally, with proper education, drivers license, the ability to read and write our language, then... and only then will I respect their roll in our society. As for uneducated "rednecks" for whom so ever you are referring to. Most of the "uneducated rednecks" I know are some very fine people, they work very hard to make a living, and I would rather them to be my neighbor as some law breaking, scum sucking, job stealing, government protected, illeagal immigrant. I moved to the midwest from California to get away from these issues, and idiots, now my city here is filling with these wetbacks, 5 years ago they would have been hung by our "uneducated rednecks"</rant>

Whew! I'll be ok, I need to lower my temperature. This really stuck a nerve, I am sorry. :eek:

Frankly, it's simply unconstitutional.....

You can't place a roadblock on a road in America and then search everyone you stop because you feel like it..... period!

I really don't give a rats ass what your motivation is, it's illegal.

Nothing more needs to be said.

That is not the case though Tiger..... undoubtedly I agree but it took finding some illegals to envoke the wrath of those in power NOT the constitution. Can't go finding illegals can we?? In fact that is only one state that has suspended them. Almost every state has had courts say it IS constitional because it's a public road and there is JUST cause to believe that motorists on holiday at 2am might be drunk. I say it's like the KGB setting up corridors with regulated travel granted as appropriate. I hate it. Probability = probible cause at random? I don't think so.

My state enacted the practice to the applause of both liberals and conservatives, but definitely mostly conservatives. They are misguided by their own sense of morality.