War has started

let me ask you this linuxelite if caches of poison **** are found or wind up being used on us (im so sick of WMD) will you change your tune or will you just shrug it off and say that bush planted it or the cia did it. Are you for reason or just anti-american. i know we all hear different versions of the news.

</end question to linuxlite>

its hard to imagine what life would be like in a world where you can pretty much do anything to anybody and get away with it as long as they couldn't prove you did it but thats pretty much the way it is these days. with the US even when we show evidence its "what do pictures and tape recordings prove?"

How about this:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,81303,00.html

Senior Defense and other U.S. officials confirmed that intelligence reports indicate that Saddam Hussein's troops are armed with chemical munitions.

"The information is raw … and hard to confirm ... but we are seeing -- using different methods -- that Saddam Hussein has armed troops south of Baghdad with chemical weapons," one official said.
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of course its bullshit...we said it. right? foxnews who believes them? their american.

Do you think our military puts on chemical warfare suits every time the sirens go off for your benifit? do you think the population of isrial is walking around with gas masks to fool you? you no doubt do. with that attitude why should we even try to convince you? do you really think your opinion should mean THAT much to us?

you prefer to believe saddam. ok fine

iraq has said it didn't tourch any oil wells...i guess we did it huh?

if one of our cities were to be falling on your heads as radioactive ash i believe youd say we did it ourselves.

The inspectors went there to discover the WMDs that the US said Saddam had, and, they never found any. US claimed that there were plenty being hidden inside Iraq, but the inspectors went in and never found anything.
And tedob, I just want a war that follows internation regulations, it isn't right for a country to say "To hell with international law, to hell with what the UN needs for a war, we're going in, and we're going to claim we're doing it all for the people".
All this "operation iraqi freedom" crap, it just blows my mind, everybody knows they're not doing it all for the iraqi people, well, everybody except one person in my english class.
If some poison attack was launched tomorrow, I'd go "Holy ****, I can't believe that happened", and then I'd hope to see some evidence about where it came from. I am for reason.And tedob, stop whining, nobody said that, we're for a war that follows regulations, and is happening for a reason. You went off on a bender, a bander of whining, trying to flame anybody who says that the US shouldn't be fighting this war.
Nobody said americans torched iraqi wells, they said the americans want those wells. Nobody said that people were pulling on gas masks for fun, they said, where are those chemical weapons everybody keep hollering about?
There is BIG DIFFERENCE between being prepared for something, and that something actually happening, just because people put on gas masks does NOT mean that there will be a chemical attack. Just because I put on shorts doesn't mean it's summer.
And tape recording are easily faked, how can I believe that this is somebody's voice if I've never actually met that person to compare with? In the last gulf war, US said 99% of patriot missiles hit their targets, when in reality it was more like 5%. How can I trust somebody with a vested interest? Get me an impartial source, and I'll give you my support.
And, on a sidenote, I would never trust anything fox reports, they often report news before it is confirmed, leading to a lot of speculation, and incorrect information.

And, I'm not trying to flame you tedob, but, surely you know how your message sounds. Sorry if you're offended.

And, people, PLEASE don't play the AP game with my thread, please.

linuxlite if i was going to be offended i wouldn't post stuff like this. im not offended

everyone's entitled to their opinion...yours just happens to be wrong....(only kidding)

the inspectors job was not to track down weapons but rather give the iraqis a chance to show one way or the other...blah, blah, blah. this has been argued to death so ill stop. were going to believe what we choose to believe but to illustrate the point to my whining which i hoped someone would do:

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I'd go "Holy ****, I can't believe that happened", and then I'd hope to see some evidence about where it came from.
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why would you need evidence about where it came from? do you really think we might gas ourselves to win your approval?

but your right about it not being all for the iraqi people. i was never meant to be. thats just a perk which my government is playing up. right now american tv has a tremendous hate campaign aimed at saddam. interviews with victims of the regime. photos of kurdish men woman and children gased to death their remaining relatives still crying today on nat'l tv. pictures of men hanging by the neck in the streets. executed for disagreeing. this is propoganda meant to raise support for the war but its still the truth. it would be nice if this were the reason for the war i dont think we'd be disagreeing right now.

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why would you need evidence about where it came from? do you really think we might gas ourselves to win your approval?

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Well, I couldn't be sure that it wasn't just some maniacal cult.

umm if we wanted their oil we would have taken it last time we were their.
or we would just invade the oil wells, and say screw saddam. and what makes you think we are keeping the oil? do u have any proof to back this up or are you just spouting?

You think the world would stand for american annexing an oil producing country? Just for it's oil? That's just world domination, that's what hitler tried. Damnit worm wood, please post something worth reading. At least have an argument.

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Originally posted here by Worm Wood
umm if we wanted their oil we would have taken it last time we were their.

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We are. It's called Food For Oil. These sanctions imposed by the UN (not the US) are responsible for massive civillian suffering in Iraq...

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or we would just invade the oil wells, and say screw saddam.

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A little too obvious and the outcry from the civilised world would be deafening! Perhaps even the start of WWIII? No, you need an evil dictator to justify things and Saddam fits the bill perfectly.

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and what makes you think we are keeping the oil? do u have any proof to back this up or are you just spouting?

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No, the oil is going to be given to a charity of your choice....... :rolleyes:

Hey Hey.....

No war comments from me this time... I've got something a little more important that our pointless debates...

http://www.sonymusic.com/artists/Sys...OOMVidFull.ram

I highly recommend that everyone who's had a voice on this subject, and those of you just lurking here, watches this...

fighting for not peace u dumb asses
thats fuking oil
its like selling water by the river
they are already in peace exept for america in the past didnot allow ppl in iraq to sell oil so some were unhappy with sadam
and i have evidences of those celebration of saddams loosing is fake and they are bribed to do that
Thats a fact
i can bring it on if u want to see it

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Originally posted here by darknhfa

and i have evidences of those celebration of saddams loosing is fake and they are bribed to do that
Thats a fact
i can bring it on if u want to see it

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Yes please.

taking iraqi oil is not an issue. those that know anything do not believe it is. the UN doesnt believe it is. the only issue here is the US acting without UN approval.

control of a resource with which saddam can cripple the western world is a factor. the iraqi oil will be given to the iraqi people. control of this resource but not the profits from IMO will remain with the allied forces. (probably under the guise of distributing the profits to the iraqi people which it will. possibly the UN will be in control of this but i doubt that now.) That is how many barells will be produced and at what price. not that the price will be low or production too great because thats exactly what we dont want. With a low price and over production they (saddams regime) can destroy every other nations oil production and bring the entire world to its knees. this falls under the general catagory of terrorism which he does support. outwardly with the money given to the families of suicide bombers. on the clandestine side US intel says he supports terrorists with funding and weapons. i expect to hear..."well you cant prove that" which were the exact words of the taliban after 911. does anybody doubt this now. Some may argue the US's method but none doubt the US's reason. IMO when this war is over everyone will know the truth which i guess is a rather obvious statement.

why this is so important now is the fact that the terrorst force which was originally only aimed at Israel has been expanded to include those that support Israel. just in case you've forgotten.

You couldn't be more right, Tedob1. How very insightful.

I'm really sorry Tedob1, I don't mean to be nit-picky, but it's Israel..... just remember the capitol next time and we'll call it even? ;)

sorry Korp! no offense meant. i wont even wait til next time. even changed the second i to an a.

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the iraqi oil will be given to the iraqi people

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A US supported government will be installed in Saddam's place, creating a US friendly government means that they will probably sell the US oil for a great price. And, until that government is in place, the US has already stated that it will hold the wells "in trust" for the iraqi people.

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which were the exact words of the taliban after 911. does anybody doubt this now

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The taliban weren't at fault for 9/11, Osama Bin Laden and his network of terrosists were, the US demolished the taliban because they were sheltering and protecting him.

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why this is so important now is the fact that the terrorst force which was originally only aimed at Israel has been expanded to include those that support Israel.

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Could you clarify please?

umm seeing how teh us and uk will be in charge of iraq until a new govt is set up, why shouldnt they be the ones to set up the trust and manageme it? do you have someone better in mind? maybe the france?

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maybe the france

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The france, um, yeah...
And no, the UN should setup a temporary comission until a provisionary government can be put in place.

Hi
this is RSND
I am new here and I was just commenting on some of the quatations.

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A US supported government will be installed in Saddam's place, creating a US friendly government means that they will probably sell the US oil for a great price. And, until that government is in place, the US has already stated that it will hold the wells "in trust" for the iraqi people.

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I belive its from linuxelite

Well i just wanted to say that this shows that they are invading IRAQ for oil.

And a question

What kind of help is that? US will help IRAQ rebuild its stuff by selling IRAQ's oil.

I dont know

I belive in that way IRAQ can do it better Than US because ITS their oil and the profit will go tho them not US's Pocket

Dont you reckon that should be the case
Its like Killing someone's cow to make him a shoe out of it
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The taliban weren't at fault for 9/11, Osama Bin Laden and his network of terrosists were, the US demolished the taliban because they were sheltering and protecting him.

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This is a good comment but i still dont get how those villege idots managed to get on a plane and successfilly hijack the planes.


They must be training for centuries

on a somewhat lighter and off topic ish subject , i found a war news source that uses gru(russian intelligence) commmunication intercptions of war goings ons which is quite interesting www.aeronautics.ru/news/news002/news076.htm

The profit WILL go to the Iraqi people, I'm fairly sure, and I thnk everybody can be fairly sure of that fact. But how much profit will there be when the US will probably be giving itself an amazing price on oil?

Although your theory would seem logical from the outside Linuxelite, the truth is we dont get much oil from Iraq. I am sure there is more behind this war than oil (its always about money). I just am asking do you think the people of Iraq need liberating?

http://www.apiinformation.org/factsh...l_imports.html , this shows the U.S. importing of oil percentages.

I believe the people need liberating. He is a dictator and mentally unstable. Not a good combo. He commits mass genocide and tried to kill Bush senior. These are a few other reasons we are why we are invading.

A soldier in Afghanistan

The people DO need liberating, but the US doesn't care about the people.
As I said before, Robert Mugabe has butchered white land owners, and because they were the farmers, his people now starve, the US did nothing.
King Jong Il, tortured his people inside pyongyang, the US did nothing.
Let's face it, this war sure as hell isn't about the people.
And, one other thing, I'm pretty sure I said before, Iraq is capable of meeting, and surpassing Saudia Arabia in oil production, their only limiting factor is their antiquated technology. Otherwise, they could export much more oil. And the US could get their hands on millions of barrels per day, for, relatively, next to nothing. It would also be a long term solution, any government in Baghdad would thereafter have strong ties with the US, and would continue to provide them with cheap oil for a long long time.

Just to be very clear I am not here to start an arguement with you. But if the U.S. doesn't do it who will? You seem to be asking why didn't America help with all those problems but then again did your country do anything to aid them? It's seems to be easy for people to point fingers at the U.S. I talk to people from all over the world and in the end we all want a good life and peace. We also have agreed there really is no easy way of getting there. I think it's great we can all come together like this and share our views. This IS what it is all about. I will never say you are wrong, we all look at things from different angles from different cultures.

As you said the U.S. government may not care about the people but I see those kids on T.V. and I pray they get a real chance at life. Its really is disheartening to see Anti-American protestors screaming and burning flags in the streets along with there children, the hate and brainwashing runs so deep in some countries that these kids will never be able to form there own opinions. If diplomacy worked 100% there never would be war but that will never happen with people that strive for nothing more that power.

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I'm sick of this argument

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Then don't come here. It's that simple. Don't neg people me because you don't like what's been going on here for a week. Just don't read it. If you had some objection to what I was saying, than that would make sense. However, you do not, you just don't like this thread, then, don't read it. So, please, no AP game, I don't want people to become scared of negs.
Also, I'm going away for about 2 weeks people. So, I won't be able to continue with this anymore, I've enjoyed it though, thanks for the discussion. I hope to read a lot more in this thread when I get back.

If, in fact, we were going into Iraq for oil alone. I would not be against it. Even down to the cellular level, the strong eats the weak. On the same token, I also care about the Iraqq people. They need us there. I woke up early and heard Bush give a warning to the people of Iraq that we are coming in. It was obviously translated into their language. It is/was not a surprise that we were coming in. There are laws of war that every American soldier is following over there, regardless of how the enemy acts. We treat POW's well and do not flaunt the enemies dead on T.V. We are doing the right thing by invading.

As to the protesters... While annoying, they have a right to voice their opinion. As a soldier, I am very angered by their response. However, I have sworn to fight for their right to do that.


Have to go, more to follow

Cor out...

All I'm going to say is that I have two family members over there now, and my boyfriend is leaving for Basic in two weeks, I just hope whatever happens, happens quickly and my family can come back home. This war has gotten extremely personal for me, and I support our troops over there, and pray for them all to come home safe. I pray for the civilians caught up in the crossfire, and the British forces fighting by our side!

yet another lesson in economics.
america will get little if any profit from the seel of the oil, it will be closly monitored and not worth the risk. the un is more corrupt than any other org. in the world and is the MOST likly to mismanage it. the few un projects that do work, are hte independent ones the operate under the un directive. to set one of those up will take months. the "profit from all this will come not from oil, but from the rebuilding. there are few componies in iraq, or even the middle east that can handle some of the things that will need to be fixed, so the us will put it up for bid. most likly a us company.

Just a small request.

Could some of you, you know who you are, please proofread your posts. It would be really nice to see proper grammar, complete sentences, and correct capitalization and punctuation. It would make reading your posts much more enjoyable, as well it would make you sound some what intelligent.

Thank you.

Yes please , it sounds like worm wood has been partaking of the famous and very potent drink made with his name (absinth )

nope, i wished though.
i just type when im at work, whitch means i am on the phone normaly talking and bringing other things us, so i type as fast as i can, and just do a quick proofread. i try to catch the most obvious, plus the fact that i never could spell anyway. lol in 4th grade my reading level was higher than most college kids yet i could never spell. drove my teachers crazy.