Passion

I'm catching up on the posts after being out of town on business. I noticed several questions asking why so much blood was involved in the movie. Now, besides for the fact that the incident was very bloody, we need to keep in mind that from the the first sacrificial lamb to Jesus, God's covenants have always been negotiated in blood. Blood is the "existing here and now" symbol of life, not crosses, water, doves, or no-smoking signs. :) A covenant made over blood is a very strong symbol of an individual's dedication to a cause, or support of an individual. Just think about how much most parents love and care for their children for a minute, when those same parents are indifferent to children not their own. This is because that child shares your blood in essence, and you will protect that child becaue of the ties of blood. It used to be that men would sacrafice animals showing his dedication and devotion to a covenant made for God. Accordingly, the blood Jesus lost is a sign of God's dedication and devotion to a covenant he made for the people of this earth.

RoadClosed: i got the sarcasim but one must allways be careful mention of the holocost is one of those things that blinds people and turns them stupid.

Ok is any one else getting sick of the crtisim of this move from people who have obviously never read the passion stories? You should know well ahead of time that it is going to be gorey, that piolet didn't condem jesus and that the angry mob was basicly the casue of his death.

What will the Gibson do with all of the moneys made off the back of the Lion of Judah ? Drill for water in africa? Give all of it away?Donate to TBN? Or pocket it like most of the filthy Jews in movie would,not to mention the showbiz!

In case you didn't notice, he's already filthy rich.

Perhaps I picked a bad example to use in my earlier post. ;)

Yeah, my points exactly, he is already rich but my question is will he keep any of the money made off the blood....................what I'm getting at is you remeber the coal miners who were stuck in the mine underground they sold their story to Disney. Surely none should profit themselves(director) from his story, I don't think christ blessed him with all of this money from passion, just to keep and to himself and every now or then give a little to charity. How much is this movie worth US dollar$ ?

Umm he is the executive producer on this on, he fundedthe project with $70 million of his own money, he refused t odo any product tie ins or on screen product ads that you see in most movies. He may make some money off of this but it wont be a killing, in fact he is takeing a great risk, if this flops hes out of a lot of cash. He accepts all the risk he deservise any profit that the movie generates, we are a cpitalistc society after all. if he gives any of it to charity (a man of his profesed faith realy ought to give some to charity) thats between him and the charity (it upsets me when people use charities as PR machines).

oh and !mitationRust considering the time I doubt many of the hebrews of the time where rich let alone filthy rich please leave your antsemitism at home.

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Originally posted here by bballad
oh and !mitationRust considering the time I doubt many of the hebrews of the time where rich let alone filthy rich please leave your antsemitism at home.

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bballad, please go back and read carefully this time, your making yourself look, well .......uneducated as usual. ;) Ask yourself this question, where did anyone state that hebrews of that time were rich. gee I'm just not seeing it, this must be a language issue because you could not of possibly been reading my post.

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Personally, I feel its totally wrong to make a entertainment movie about Jesus.

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Well since it wasn't meant to be for our entertainment, I guess it's ok. It was meant to convict Christians....make us aware of the price paid.

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It still comes back to a lack of roma recordes, they kept records of all of their convicts no such records exist for jesus nor dose he exist on the cencus. Now there are many reasons that could be, its not uncommon for the roman records on the frontier t obe incompleate, lost, or distroyed, but it dose leave that bit of doubt.

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First of all, Jesus wasn't a Roman convict, so why should there be records of Him as such? The Romans convicted him of nothing. (There were plenty of secular records of him being crucified anyway). Not to mention the writings of those closest to Him, including the Gosples....even if you don't accept the Bible as inerrant, it should certainly be admissable just as a person's (or in this case, several people's) testimonies to what happened.

Second, how often was the census taken? He avoided the first one b/c they were looking for all children of his age to kill them all at the same time they took the census so they fled....obviously Herod believed there was something special/threatening about Him if he killed all children His age just to try and kill Him. Then He died appx age 33....a census was difficult to take with their lack of technology so why count all citizens over and over again instead of just taking one and then adding to it as you annex territories. I doubt if they did the Census often... (The "kill all children" thing happened once in the old testament too when the Egyptians felt threatened by the growing Hebrew population and Moses was the one that fled that time....just in case it sounded familiar to you).

Third: there were plenty of records of Him *anyway*....the writings of Pontius Pilate is an excellent example. Proving that He existed isn't a problem....proving that He is God is what the debate is about.

Heres some trivia to support the case that The Passion isn't anti sematic-

When Jesus is being nailed to the cross, Mel is the one holding the nail. He did this on purpose to symbolize who killed Jesus. By having himself hold the nail, and not being a jew, he symbolizes that it wasnt romans, jews, or whoever that killed jesus, it was sinners. Everyone is a sinner whether they like it or not, and Jesus died for the sinners.

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the writings of Pontius Pilate

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lets append a couple more : Talmud, Josephus, Tacitus, Pliny the Younger, etc.

Jesus died for our sins.

Why?
So that we could recieve the eternal life, and not the eternal death wich was what previously used to be.

Why did God send Jesus and why diddn't He just do it Himself?
God made a promise to Adam and Eve(wich means all humens) that if they eat from the tree in the middle that they would die(wich means not having eternal life ,not in heaven nor on earth).
Jesus was sent to take away all our sins(death), so that we, again, could live forever,but only if we believe.
Jesus came to earth as a human, to die as a human, so that the human can be relieved of his eternal sin(death).

So why do I still have/commit "sins"?
Before Christ, it was "sins" that kept us from Heaven.
When Christ came He said that only through believing in God(Father,Son and Holy Ghost) would one recieve eternal life.
The fact He didn't talk about sins(at the time He said this), has been enterpreted by as:
A sin is something that takes your believe in God, away.
This leads to the next question.

What is believe/believing in God?
Believing in God mean:
*To believe the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost are all ONE being(all think/feeling alike) with 3 persons.
(a "person" means something/someone that can feel/think for itself)
*To believe He exists in a world beyond ours.
*To believe He has an force/influence here on earth.
*To believe that what He said/says(Bible) is the truth.

By having sex before mariage, stealing, gambling...etc, you are not respecting what God ASKED us to keep away from, thus you are not believing in Him(thinking God wont do anything to you), thus taking your believe away from God, thus sinning.

DON'T sin,
DON'T support this movie
and
BELIEVE IN GOD

I'm gonna go see this movie.

mel is already gonna do really well with it, and I'm happy its gone over this well.

handzcleanx I believe in God, but don't see anything wrong with gambling really. I mean whats wrong with it? Your not disobeying any of the ten commandments.

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Why?
So that we could recieve the eternal life, and not the eternal death wich was what previously used to be.

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We never had to have eternal death handzcleanx. The thing that changed after christ died on the cross, was that all we had to do to be forgiven of sins was to pray to god and accept him into our heart. Before he died, one had to sacrifice a burnt offering to him.

Why shouldn't I support this movie?

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Originally posted here by !mitationRust
bballad, please go back and read carefully this time, your making yourself look, well .......uneducated as usual. ;) Ask yourself this question, where did anyone state that hebrews of that time were rich. gee I'm just not seeing it, this must be a language issue because you could not of possibly been reading my post.

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Sorry you just called them "filthy jews" again leave your antismeitism at home thats a quick way to get booted.

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Originally posted here by Agent_Steal
lets append a couple more : Talmud, Josephus, Tacitus, Pliny the Younger, etc.

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Comeon guys the rightings of Pilot have long been shown to be a hoax, Josephus dson't mention jesus and nethier do the dead see scroles (the group the josephus was with and betraed). Not sure on the rest, sent a note out to a friend in greek lituratre to see about their reliability. Also be careful commenting on greek or greek traind historians (most of the romans) they made it a rule to never let the facts get in the way of a good story.