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Well... NO SH1T... There's already enough laws out there for a competent prosecutor to work with... But if the politicians can't point to some bullsh1t law they created while in power then they feel they can't get re-elected... That's BS... If I could vote here I would vote for the guy that repealed the most laws....Quote:
The best thing Bush can do, is get off his ass, grow some balls and restrict imigration and enforce existing laws that track criminal finance and movement.
Shhhh, you're rationalizing now. You're not allowed to do that. It's our patriotic duty to overreact and blow anything and everything entirely out of context/proportion (even though we know better).Quote:
Originally posted here by AngelicKnight
Do you really think they're looking at anyone's phone numbers other than ligitimately suspicious people? Why would they? I doubt there's someone randomly looking at what phone numbers called what other phone numbers because he has nothing else to do.
However, if I have the phone number for Terrorist Wannabe #1 who's part of Terrorist Cell A, I can see what other phone numbers have been calling him often, and maybe that'll lead to Terrorist Wannabe #2. Given there's no actual privacy being violated here, I say go for it.
Heck, even if they DID spy on my phone calls...they'd just be bored to death. :)
People freak out about such matters for the same reasons kids in school cling to drama despite their vocal resentment of it--people just like to b**** about everything and anyone....other than themselves and their own actions of course.
"Overreaction" seems about right?
I think that people lose track of the fundamental question which is "what actually is private and personal information"
A telephone number belongs to a telephone, just as a registration number belongs to a vehicle. Both of them are machines rather than human individuals. You cannot prove who made the telephone call based on the telephone number, neither can you prove who the driver was purely on the vehicle registration number.
Over here the authorities have access to the name and address of the telephone customer and the registered keeper of a vehicle without any recourse to the courts. The information is not acceptable as evidence in the courts, so does not fall into one of the protected classes of data.
There is even a similarity with guns. Ballistics can match a bullet to a weapon, but you still have to prove who fired it?
;)
It's a tough and complex issue, with danger on each extreme,
and it's difficult to find the balanced position in the middle.
Unlike many, I have very little fear of the present administration,
but the laws they pass will enable future presidents with the same
powers. Maybe a radical leftist faction gets elected and uses
the patriot act to persecute jews.
Few of us will object to emergency measures during an emergency.
the problem is that we have a very large part of the public that believes
that 9-11 and the war on terror are a right wing conspiracy. They are against
any restriction on civil liberties. This very same faction
passionately believes that global warming is an imminent threat of
global catastrophe, and would gladly suspend civil liberties to deal
with this emergency. We are headed for civil war.
:cool:
Hi rcgreen ,
I found this particular thread very interesting if only because these powers already exist over here, and have done for a long time. Nobody seems in the least bit concerned in the UK.
The police can get details of calls to and from a telephone, the registered customer details, location etc. The same goes for motor vehicles and (obviously) firearms.
The taxation people can get identity details from your doctor and dentist and probably optometrist. NOT TREATMENT DETAILS though....................I guess that is the price of state funded healthcare? The intention is to prevent fraud, not to spy on people. Obviously Social Welfare Benefits details are available to all the enforcement agencies.
Hadn't you better finish the last one first? According to our history books the "Northern War of Economic Aggression" had to be rescheduled due to a waterlogged playing field?............or was it a big fire in the away stadium (Atlanta?)Quote:
We are headed for civil war.
:p :D
I notice that you believe in "hiding in plain sight"?................the accomplices who stole your avatar (The Scream) just got 8+ years each in Norway............and the authorities want it returned! :D
I really hate to pi$$ on everyone's fireworks but if any of you are dumb enough to believe you have any privacy nowadays then you are severly mistaken. The government can find out whatever they want about you whenever they want to. Don't fool yourselves into believing they can't.
That is a good point. I don't think any of us should be suprised by this. I would put money on the fact they are spying much more than this. This is just a tease.Quote:
Originally posted here by Tiger Shark
I really hate to pi$$ on everyone's fireworks but if any of you are dumb enough to believe you have any privacy nowadays then you are severly mistaken. The government can find out whatever they want about you whenever they want to. Don't fool yourselves into believing they can't.
AngelicKnight is right, they would be bored to death with us...
Where's my tinfoli hat?
-Deeboe
Not long after 911 I read Margret Atwoods "A Handmaids Tale"
I recommend it.
It kinda reminds me of the Bush administration....
The Moral majority ;)
MLF
There's no such thing as the moral majority... They are a minority... Just like the screaming libs are a minority... It's just that they both make more noise...
The fact is that, if they got off their lazy, apathetic a$$es, the "immoral majority", of which I am firmly a member, would kick all these silly little "groups" out of power for ever!!!
I just see Americans cant see the forest for the trees........
I personally think your rights are being tromped on......and your current administration has an alternative agenda....with all the fear\war mongering ......and the want of control of the middle east oil.....
I dont trust them......gut feeling ;)
MLF