When is there a need for war? When the terriorists blow up Ontario, Quebec, or Victoria?Quote:
This isn't a War, I realize there is, at times, a need for war.... There is no need right now... ...
cheers
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When is there a need for war? When the terriorists blow up Ontario, Quebec, or Victoria?Quote:
This isn't a War, I realize there is, at times, a need for war.... There is no need right now... ...
cheers
Yeah... poor brave souls... He only had to wait four hours for the lighting to be perfect and the make-up to be applied and then he posed for that picture... That's why no pictures of caskets... We want to make people sad... a single mocked up soldier does that.... rows of coffins make people realize what a waste this "war" is.... They want support.... and the sheep are giving in as expected.Quote:
Originally posted here by morganlefay
Wow
Didnt mean to stir up the **** here.....
I do not blame the brave souls that are over there for what they are doing....
I pray the come home soon to thier families and loved ones..
I am just questioning **WHY** they are there in the first place..
And from that picture........maybe those brave souls are questioning it too
Peace
MLF
As for why they are there... Revenge and Oil... Bush as basically admitted that.. we all know it... unfortunately Americans are too spineless to stand up to Bush... they give in to him and follow his orders no matter how ridiculous they are.
Peace,
HT
I've yet to see the terrorists step in and attack innocent people.... The US kept sticking it's nose where it didn't belong.... retaliation happened... Canada does't go sticking it's noses in other countries business.... That's the US and the US alone...Quote:
Originally posted here by Relyt
When is there a need for war? When the terriorists blow up Ontario, Quebec, or Victoria?
cheers
If we're attacked by terrorists... then I'll look into why it happened.. if like the US I was attacked because of my own greed to rule the world.. I'll walk away from it.. If it was unprovoked.. I'll be pissed off... If they come back and try to invade us... then I'll say there's a need for war and I'll defend my country...
Jesus (for those that believe he existed) once said "Destroy this temple and I will rebuild it..." Destroy parts of my country and I'll rebuild it... try to take my country... that's when I defend it...
Walking away from a single incident or a series of incidences isn't a sign of cowardess... It's a sign of intelligence.... Walking away from an invasion would be stupidity... that's why I don't blame the Iraqi's for killing Americans...
Peace,
HT
Is everyone reading this too? This is great, the kid doesn’t even know what terrorism is. You’re untutored, a result of living in your bubble. ;)Quote:
Originally posted here by HTRegz
I've yet to see the terrorists step in and attack innocent people....
Peace,
HT
Alright.... let me qualify that... I've yet to see the terrorists attack innocent people in North America.... With what the US government gets into... Americans aren't innocent... so my statement is true.Quote:
Originally posted here by !mitationRust
Is everyone reading this too? This is great, the kid doesn’t even know what terrorism is. You’re untutored, a result of living in your bubble. ;)
Peace,
HT
ughhhhhh,
Perspective!!! This is not about oil or any other of the superficial items thus far brought up. It has always been about the sons and daughters of Haggar. Religion
cheers
Just shhhhhhhhh.......with your chirping little bird. You can't come back from any of your asinine statements. Just fly, fly, away! We might throw you some popcorn another time.
So what you said about there being only 2 Wars that you would see as being justifed means Korea, is one you disagree with as well.Quote:
And the rest of my quote said I have no more respect for the Canadian military.
My Dad fought in Korea, along with a lot of other Canadain Soldiers and Sailors, so you have no respect for them is what you are saying, I don't know why you have such a hate on for the Military but to actually take a sick delight in other soldiers being killed is way off base. :mad:
I will say though that the reason you are able to say the things you are, is down to the fact that thousands of men and women gave their lives, the ultimate sacrifice so you could enjoy the freedoms you enjoy today.
Wether or not you agree with the politics of the current US administration, in no way should it be directed at the men and women in uniform.
I spouted off a few times in this thread about the policies being done in the name of a "just" war and in some respects I will agree it is not a war as such but an occupation, so what is happening now is no different then what the Nazi's experienced when they occupied Paris, the partisans working with the underground and foreign intelligence caused the Nazi's headaches. My point is if this is a War then where are the battles? I am sure that every soldier who walks down a street in Iraq, must feel the hatred from the locals, and would as soon be home if asked.
To the guys who are vets and fought in any conflicts, my hat is off to you, I was involved in Desert Storm with the Canadian Navy in the Gulf.That one to me was the one where the story should have ended, I can't help but be cynical when I see the current President of the US trying to atone for his daddies mistake, because believe me, not going in and finishing the job then was a mistake, and as far as I am concerned there was more justification then, to see it too the end.
Also come on guys, do you really think the Iraqi army was in any way a threat to the safety and freedom of the Continental United States of America. Also as they had no Navy I am sure the warships in the gulf were not at any time threatened, hell since Desert Storm the Iraqi's had no airforce, remember he moved them to Iran hoping to get them back later, boy was he stupid.
Dalek - finally someone with at least a little sense. Dad fought in Korea. Mine did too, as well as two tours in Veitnam. Korea was never a declared war, but the soldiers fighting and dying in the field didn't know the difference. Frankly, I don't either. For whatever reason we were there, or in Veitnam, or in Afghanistan, or Iraq, we were there. We were sent, and we did (and are still doing) our jobs, something other posters here fail to realize.
Are we just there to clean up Dubya's daddy's mess? Probably - I've said so in other posts in other threads, and I still believe it, but that makes no difference ultimately. The fact is we're there, and our military is fighting, and they deserve our support and the support of our allies like Canada.
Where's the war in Iraq now? It's still there, it's just gone to gorilla actions - terrorist strikes as opposed to front line warfare. Just as the British paid dearly for trying to wage war in the 'traditional sense' of the times during the American Revolutionary war, our forces are having to learn and master the recognition and counterattacks to these new methods. We started learning that lesson in Veitnam, and it continues today - we're just a bit better at it now because we're capable of learning. Will Iraq become just like Veitnam in the long run? Highly unlikely - Congress ran the Veitnam war according to the political whims of the times - when it was popular to fight, we took territory. When it wasn't so popular, we handed back that same territory without any struggle. In Veitnam we learned that politicians aren't military commanders, and our politicians learned to leave the military alone and let it do its job. The mistakes of Veitnam I hope and believe will never be repeated because we shall never forget it.
Now back to the present day -
Yes, our ships in the gulf are threatened. They are threatened by everything from missile strikes to gunboats to mines to biological strikes. These threats are very real, we just don't hear about them stateside. One of the things that needs to be realized is that our current enemy isn't the Iraqi people, it's the terrorists that dwell amongst those people. These militant insurgents can recruit anyone from a housewife to a child to a dog in the street and turn them into a walking bomb simply to kill our servicemen. Interesting parallel, the same thing happened in Veitnam - the kids with hand-grenades. Back then our solution was to shoot any kid that approached our troops too quickly - which got us labelled 'child killers' and spit upon. I'm curious how it'll be solved now, if it is.
Folks, all bullshit and petty sniping aside, we are looking for a way out of Iraq, but before we can go, the Iraqis have to be able to set up their own military and government and make it strong and self-sufficient so that some other power-hungry would-be dictator doesn't seize power and cause us to have to invade yet again. I'd rather go through years of waiting it out like we are than to have our kids and grandkids need to start the whole thing over 10 years from now.
Are we bullies looking for a fight? You betcha. After 9/11 we're spoiling to destroy every single terrorist out there if at all possible. You would be too I'm quite sure. Once again though, I've got to admit that I'm against war on a concept, which is precisely what a war on terrorism is. Where's the capital city of a concept? Where does it keep its army or grow its food? How do you attack and destroy a concept? The answer is simple - you don't. IMHO it's like a child crying out for the moon and its daddy not being able to hand it down to it. Since we're already in the thick of things however, now is NOT the time to turn our backs on it - we've got to ride the pony until it drops and learn our lessons from it, just as we've done in every single conflict we've been involved with since our founding fathers in 1776.
Our friend HTRegwanker wants to piss on returning veterans. He's said so himself in his own posts in this thread. I firmly believe that this method is the absolute wrong thing that can be done, and that he, himself, should be pissed upon - perhaps he'll learn...then again perhaps he won't - he waves his college degree in his 'mood' like it's a serious accomplishment yet he fails to learn anything whatsoever from the real world. I personally think a good 4 year stint in his country's "Peacekeeping forces" might do him some good. At the very least it'll stop his bleeding heart ideology and his thoughts about modern military and its lack of respect for anything. Somehow I seriously doubt he has the testicular fortitude to defend his own country, so a stint in the service is probably a pipe-dream. Ah well, some folks are like that. We let them prattle on meaninglessly all the while reminding ourselves that it was for their right to say and do what they do that we served.
The question was raised earlier if I believe I'm as good as the guys who fought in WWI and WWII because I fought in Desert Storm. Well, let me ask my Grandfather, who was a bombardier in WWII aboard B-17's over Germany. He says I am. Dad does too. I'm sure if Great Grandpa was still around he'd tell me that 'over there is over there, whether it's in the desert or in Germany' and that there's no difference between fighting the Kaiser and fighting Saddam. Great Grandpa was a doughfoot in WWI. Sorry guy, hate to tell ya, but as far back as my family name can be traced, there's a veteran in EVERY generation, and yes, we're all every bit as good as the generations before us, because we all share the same common bond - we served to protect our country and our freedoms. My eldest son just returned after his 2nd tour in Iraq. He's leaving the Marine Corps now, opting to go to college. He's every bit my equal, and my Father's, and my Grandfather's, and every relative preceding him, and we're all very proud. In his 6 years active duty he's done 2 tours in Afghanistan and 2 in Iraq. He's very well earned the Sergeant's stripes he wears and the medals that'll grace the display case we're making for him. More than that, he's earned his right to spout off about any war or 'unwar' in which we fight, something that the pacifists present have failed to do.
Regwanker -
Ok, that's it, my final input. Feel free to pick it apart as you see fit you gutless ignorant pacifist, I'm quite sure you will. I've had my say and won't waste any further time or effort on you.
Hey Hey,
A four year stint wouldn't do me any good... Force me to carry a gun and as soon as you give it to me, I'm just going to shoot everyone around me in uniform...
As for your family thinking you're a real vet... you come from a country of war mongers... I'm not surprised... It's no different than your government thinking you're a vet.
As for earning my right... I've earned my right... By protesting against the war.. He has no right to speak out against the war.... I opted to not go to war, even when offered 42,000/year + a 20,000 signing bonus, I decided that I wouldn't do it because it was against what I believed in... I considered it... and realized that I'm not that person.... The only right your son has earned is to die next to you as a war monger... Go kill some more innocent people... When someone steps in and shoots your family as they sleep, maybe then you'll realize why some of us choose to be pacifists.
Peace,
HT