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I thought that the original purpose behind antipoints was to help weed out those who continually made bad posts, but instead people are using it to play stupid games concerning who they think is "stupid." This abuse of the system is wasteful. My suggestion is to abolish the system totally. Since negative antipoints dont prevent someone from posting, and positive antipoints have no real incentive, this would be an easy transition.
Couldn't agree more.
It's kind of a weird social pecking order thing here. I mean, the ones with quite a few Anit Points are senior memebers with a lot of posts, most of those are good too. Yet I could give anyone + or - ap's for any reason I choose. ThePreacher, I could decide to give you + or - right now for absolutely no reason, other than I want to click on the link and either talk **** or praise you for a job well done.
Your post could have said bL3Tch or fo0 or barF with no content and I can give you some + ap's. Conversely you could have written an `epitome of modern computer security' and I could give you - ap's with a comment like *UberC0der 0wn5 j00*, or ***** OFF for no apparent reason outside of immaturity.
In a perfect world with mature users (Which AO does not [always] have), the ap system would work well, other than the issues those with less ap's would have.
I was waiting for somebody to post this. I wanted to post it myself, but I figured I would just come off as a whiner. I agree completely. It has been nothing but a source of tension and fighting almost since the beginning. It has been the point of hehbris's membership. He loves to piss people off with AntiPoints. It also leaves a lot of people in fear of speaking their minds. They know if they do, they will be rained on by negative points. Maybe I'm wrong, but I have never heard of dissenting opinions deserving negative points. I say we should let people's posts determine a person's reputation, and stop AntiPoints from getting in the way.
You should post a poll on this. When people can post their opinion anonymously, you will probably get better feedback. I'll bet a lot of people will agree with you.
...Or, we could set some standards for AntiPoints. I mean, this is the earliest stage of the system, of course there are going to be a few 'bugs' - in this case, being irrisponible and immiture users - but lets not trash the whole idea. Maybe if there was some regulation, or rules, maybe even standards that you must follow in order to give somebody a postive or negative AntiPoint. For instance: Maybe your name will always be givin...or you must always post a comment (for I have a few with no comment whatsoever). Who knows, maybe even throw in something together where Senior Members get 'special priveledges' with a certian amount of AntiPoints - this may or may not include only Senior Members of course.
But what you have to understand is that, yes, there are going to be computer illiterate little punks running around the place - for they are everywhere. And yes, there are going to be the few that post helpful, useful, benefitial comments and positive or negative AntiPoints where needed. Don't be disgraced so soon... lets just see what happens. Maybe JP is working on a "Versian 2.0" or something. Heh...funny to think of it like that...
In theory, it's a good idea. In practice...well...two people were banned cause of it. People, including myself, have been bitching about it for awhile.
In theory, JP's measures should allow the good posters to get points. The bad posters wouldn't be allowed to affect anything.
In practice, the antipoints have proved themselves unworthy. They're a good idea, but there should be different, safer ways to earn them. And the negative antipoints should be reserved only for truly bad posts.
Maybe each post should get a voting box. If enough people dislike it then the poster gets negative antipoints. One person's opinion shouldn't be enough, I don't think.
Another think that'd be nice would be more classifications then Senior, Normal, and Junior members. Maybe the members with lots of posts and lots of points get Uber member or something else. And the people with lots of bad posts...well you can come up with your own ideas.
well first of all, there is no point in bitching, cause jp isn't going to get rid of the system.
second, the point system in theory is a good idea. but like all good ideas, it needs some refining. for example, i think you should be able to take back antipoints if you make a mistake (within x number of days or hours or something)i think that the solution is a list where everyone votes on what changes they think should be made. the top x (x being a number that can be later determined.) and those should be implemented.
(sung to theme of krusty krab pizza)
antipoints system, is not the system, for you and me, absolutively!
ahem! i couldn't agree more that antipoints system as it is now is completely useless.
I, along with stflook (and many others, i'm sure), have been waiting for this very thread.
Plain and simple...if the AP system continues being used as it is currently being used, FLUSH IT!
The idea is sound, but like I have said in other posts relating to it, anything involving input(interactivity) of opinion, WILL be abused by those that: a) like to piss people off(as everyone DOES sigh when recieving negative points, like it is an assault on one's character, integrity, etc), or b) just like hitting random buttons.
Good ideas will always be subject to scrutiny and abuse...but then that good idea should be modified accordingly (Terr's idea that i originally opposed is a good example).
As I see it, there should be a good reason for recieving negAP, like: being a jerk, posting falsehoods or with less than honest motivations (the hotmail, etc, kiddies), lying to cover one's own ass, etc.
Likewise, recieving the posAP should be for: being respectful and decent, posting helpful and informative things, and asking relevant and worthwhile questions (NOT 'how do i hack (blank))...
Just my opinion, of course...
Either way, it's beyond anyone's control...anyone except for the creator of it...
Ouroboros
Having not been a member very long, and not really understanding the whole concept/idea behind the antipoints system (other than what I read), I can think of a rather fast workaround for making it a bit more serious to post positive/negative points towards someone's post.
These are all hypothetical and may be completely ignored but they're ideas nonetheless:
1: javascript a yes/no before assignment. While this stops absolutely no-one from posting negative points just because, it makes them go the extra step to "fire and forget".
2: Allow everyone to see "what side of the scale" any member is for assignment, meaning if I have a total of 30 point assignments and 20 of them are negative while 10 are positive, I'll show as "negative assigner" or some shite...
3: combination of 1 & 2?
4: laugh me out of the forums?
actually, i dont have a clue on 'antipoints' i think there is no logic behind this...
Hey ! Antipoints is the thing i'm living for ! I mean, i'm posting only for antipoint, hopping that "one day" someone will be so estonished by my answer, that he will gently give 1 positive points :D
Just kidding, but personnaly i like this antipoints system, when senior member answer your and he comes with big home made logo, big post number (>300) and green pixels.... you're saying "ouch... the big security/system/network guru is answering me, take care of what he is saying !
Negative antipoints are more useless, because you can give it for whatever reason.
Please do not remove antipoints !
A+ hantiz.
antipoints.
first of all, we agree that this isn't working. so here is my solution for it.
instead of one person being able to give out + or - points, it would go to a poll. what i mean is that one person can't hand out antipoints. it would work something like this.
it would take 3 people to give someone a good antipoint, and it would take 4 people to give someone a bad antipoint.
-Havanger
Well basicly the Apoints system is good, it are the users who are bad.
And in reply on some questions I do think there's some logic behind the points. The points from people with many points count more than other.
If I could change the AP system I would make it more transparent (no anonymous points for example), and make the rules more transparant (when do your point counts...?)
Or give the senior members with lots of posts like Ennis, Negative,... more credit or an other status (ultra senior or elite or something) but again there are some users that make many posts with no meaning but flaming (S*******12) I think (my opinion) they don't deserve some extra credits. (Don't shoot me for this)
I recieve Apoints from time to time which do not increase or decrease my total amount of points so there is some logic behind the thing. I'am sure Ennis can explain this more / better than I'am doing now.
I just wanted to be sure that everyone involved in this thread as read the explanation about antipoints :
http://www.antionline.com/showthread...hreadid=118645
Sorry if you did. Do it if did not.
A+ hantiz./
My intention is not to disrespect JP, but I have noticed that many of the things promised by use of the antipoint system have never been given. For example:
I have yet to see this, however since I have few antipoints, I ask the members with a high number of points to respond and tell me the additional site features that are available.Quote:
In the future, you will be able to "spend" your AntiPoints on additional site features and gear.
There are currently many users out there abusing the system, and with apparently no reaction from JP. I am not against this originally good idea, but I feel that it is an abused and useless system. I have recieved more than my fair share of negative antipoints for asking questions in relation to security, networking, programming, and more. Most of the time the responses are limited to "**** You", or "You are a faggot and you post too much". The thing is that I know these are coming from senior members, by the number of points I lose each time. I don't know if I am an equal contributer here on antionline, but many people have sent me private messages saying that I am. If JP ever goes through and reads this, I hope that he makes a change, since recieving negative antipoints is so intimidating that I have seen many members here on antionline feel like they shouldnt come back. Ive seen many people who come here just to flame and get showered with praise while I almost never make posts flaming another user, ask security questions and lose more antipoints daily. Why do I still come here if this bothers me so much? I have the hope that the positive members will rub their influence off on others, and this will become the ideal internet security related site that it was supposed to be. Abolish the antipoint system, and free us from our enemies.Quote:
If you are caught attempting to abuse the AntiPoints System, your account will be removed. Period!
right well i think there needs to be more explaining on why people will give out negative antipoints. here are what some of my negative antipoints say:
"shoot first and ask quesitons later"
"Terribly wrong idea about Windows and Linux, Im not gonna reply Ill let yoy figure it out yourself."
-havanger
I really like the 'User's Antipoint Stats' idea, Vorlin. Just show what % of their total-given-to-assign antipoints they use per month on positive or negative comments.
The second thing is... PUT THEM IN THE PROFILE. That way you aren't judged every time someone reads your post, you have to 'go one click further' in order to see someone's AP level.
I think JP put too much work into it to want to abolish it, and it can be useful sometimes... Maybe if we could just de-emphasize it, making it more of a statistical fact about a user, rather than a bit thing in other people's eyes.
Things already discussed many times:
1) Removing it
2) Always showing the name
3) Always needing comments
4) Point variation due to if comments exist
I think we can safely say that the last two would just make people add in 'aaaaa' or something for a comment. The first one is probably not gonna happen soon, and the second one will just exacerbate flame wars.
I bet that the AP system was made with good intentions but its becoming more a nuisance now that people are abusing it. I'm not gonna name any names. There is almost no purpose to the system anyways because points shouldnt be based if you agree with a statement or not. People are allowed to have different opinions and they should not be criticized by other people. Even though the points system might have been started to allow users to compliment the author in making a statement that was well thought out, most people just use the system for either vendetta or just to flame. I think that AO would do just fine without the AP system.
:hiphop:
Greetings:
We will always be improving the AntiPoints system, but it's not going anywhere. Thanks for the suggestion though.