Diane Pretty dies - Finally!

Hmmm, I hope I got your attention with that subject... Here's the story:

Quote:

---

BBC News
A terminally ill British woman who lost a legal battle to allow her husband to help her commit suicide has died, her family have said.
Diane Pretty, who was in the advanced stages of motor neurone disease, died at a hospice near her home on Saturday, aged 43.

The mother-of-two had begun experiencing breathing difficulties 10 days ago, three days after she lost her right-to-die court challenge in the European Court of Human Rights.

Her husband Brian said "I was with Diane most of the day and was about to come home when I was stopped and told it was time.

"And then for Diane it was over, free at last."

He was "very proud" of her, Mr Pretty added.

His wife always said she wanted her husband to help her commit suicide because she feared the choking and asphyxia often caused by her disease.

'Staff wonderful'

Mr Pretty was at his wife's bedside when she died.

In a statement issued on Sunday by the Voluntary Euthanasia Society (VES), which supported the couple in their legal fight, he said she had slipped into a coma after suffering breathing difficulties.

"On Thursday 2 May, Diane asked me to call the doctor as she was having trouble with her breathing," he said.
She had no chest infection and her airways were clear.
The next day she went into the hospice and started having breathing problems again.
The doctors and nurses managed to get her stable for a few days but she was still in pain.
The staff were wonderful at their job and there was always someone there with her."

Historic ruling

"They had trouble getting her comfortable and pain-free until Thursday evening, after which she started to slip into a coma-like state and eventually died.
Diane had to go through the one thing she had foreseen and was afraid of - and there was nothing I could do to help."

In an historic ruling last month, European judges dismissed Mrs Pretty's claim that the British courts were contravening her human rights by refusing to allow her husband to help her commit suicide.
The ruling marked the end of the legal road for Mrs Pretty, who criticised the decision.
After it was announced, she told a news conference in London: "The law has taken all my rights away."
After Mrs Pretty's death on Sunday, Dr Ryszard Bietzk, head of medical services at the Pasque Hospice, Luton, where Mrs Pretty was cared for, said her death was "perfectly normal, natural and peaceful".
George Levvy, chief executive of the Motor Neurone Disease Association, said: "Diane showed great courage and determination, both in her battle against motor neurone disease and in her campaign through the courts.
"Her story has highlighted the devastating nature of MND and the need for people with the disease to have the best in palliative and terminal care."

But campaigners who had fought to block her case stood by their decision.

Rachel Hurst, director of Disability Awareness in Action, said it would be "very wrong for justice to say in certain circumstances people can die".

"It would be a slippery slope and many people who did not want to die could be affected," she said.

---

- Should on be allowed to commit suicide (don't know about the States, but in most European countries suicide is a crime)?
- Should one be allowed to help someone else commit suicide?
- Will allowing that lead to murder?
- If allowing it, who should be the judge? And what should the judgement be based on? What exactly should be allowed - what 'techniques' to commit suicide? - who should be allowed to help someone else commit suicide?
- ...

Put it into historical context.

Euthanasia

:cool:

From a biblical perspective, suicide is sin. No, I do not know where, this is just because the religious zealots(no offense, I mean the extreme ones) will likely have something to say about it.
From a legal perspective, this is way to hard to manage. First of all, if this is freely done (some type of consent contract or such), a person could force people to sign, then kill them, or they could coerce others into it (whether or not they know what they are doing). If there is a court you have to go through in order to obtain permission, the risks dramatically decrease, but they are still large as coerced person can likely stand up to normal questioning. Along with that, any laws pertaining to restrictions on who can and who can't do it will have to be very(nay, extremely) carefully worded, and will still be under heavy attack.
In short, not allowing anyone to perform suicide saves a lot of trouble both legally and politically.

From a strictly sentimental point of view, it would break my heart to watch my husband suffer through the exact thing he was scared of. I know it is a very sticky legal issue, but on the other hand, it seems that it is something intensely personal. It would be nice if we could do what we know in our hearts is right, and not have to worry about what bad people might do.

As some of you know, I am a religious person, and I don't think God could call this a sin. I don't know, it isn't really discussed under these circumstances in the Bible. But I can't see how helping someone to end such intense suffering and misery would be sinful.

I pray to God that I am never in this situation. I know what my decision would be.

Deb :)

When you have a dog that's a gimp, can't walk, can't enjoy life, in pain all of the time, you have mercy on that poor creature. Why is it that we don't have the same respect for humans, I wonder....seems odd to me.

I understand what a complicated issue this is and I may be simplifying it a bit, but i believe life is to be enjoyed, not endured. Of course it's up to individual but my feeling on the matter is quite clear.

Euthanasia does not equal suicide.

However, you have to look at the possibility that the reason someone is trying for doctor assisted suicide is that they are too afraid to do it themselves. Killing yourself is a mentally difficult thing to do. If it wasn't, we'd all do it at one time or another. The best way to do it owuld be this: Make available to them the means to kill themselves. Get it set up, etc., but leave the final choice, the responsibility for pushing the button, in their hands. I could see this being difficult in that case of severely paralised people, but I think it's the best solution.

Quote:

---

I know it is a very sticky legal issue, but on the other hand, it seems that it is something intensely personal.

---

It might be personal to you, but to your Health Insurance
company it's all about money.
Can you imagine the "big discount" you could get on
health insurance if you signed that form giving them
permission to "relieve your loved one from excessive suffering"

People will sign this stuff ahead of time, not really knowing
the implications. Then one day when you take granny to
the hospital for some minor ache, they'll decide that
it's too expensive to treat her and they'll
"relieve her of her suffering"

It's a bad idea.
:cool:

a tough question. Was there not some Dr Kevorkian who tried this route (assisted suicide) and was charged?

Quote:

---

Originally posted here by KorpDeath
When you have a dog that's a gimp, can't walk, can't enjoy life, in pain all of the time, you have mercy on that poor creature. Why is it that we don't have the same respect for humans, I wonder....seems odd to me.

I understand what a complicated issue this is and I may be simplifying it a bit, but i believe life is to be enjoyed, not endured. Of course it's up to individual but my feeling on the matter is quite clear.

Euthanasia does not equal suicide.

---

I totally agree...

This is a subject that invokes lots of different feelings from people, should a person who is suffering from a very painful illness be told by the courts that they have to live with the pain and suffering. I have seen to many people die from very serious illnesses like cancer and I do believe that they should have the choice to end their life if they can no longer deal with the pain. What gives us the right to say to someone YOU MAY NOT KILL YOUR SELF YOU MUST SUFFER THE PAIN INSTEAD. Does this not seem cruel and unusual punishment for these people. We keep saying that we are such a caring species but to me this seems so wrong, it seems like a type of abuse that we are inflicting on sick people.

My mother fought with cancer most of my childhood, went through radiation, killed the cancer, but in turn, ruined so much of the healthy tissue in her body that her organs began to deteriorate. We have talked about the possibility of assisted suicide many times. It tears at my heart to think that I could lose my mother, but I look at it in two ways:

1. I can either lose her to her health, which would be a painful and excruciating death.

or

2. I can lose her with the least amount of pain possible.

Maybe people would be more openminded to the idea if some close relative or themselves fought with a losing battle, one that would cause you to lose your dignity because you could no longer care for yourself anymore, or one that just causes a great deal of pain.

I don't believe that it's right for a person to make decisions for someone else. If my mother would like this done, then it's her choice. We have discussed going to court several times, but unfortunately, we ultimately decided against it. It would take forever to go through litigation that controversial. I don't want to spend the time with my mom that I have left through memories of lawyers and reporters....

I don't know....

death of a person send them on to whatever is after this. If this is going to end in a bad way, due to circumstances that are out of your controll (meaning health wise, ETC) then you should be able to go. Death isent jsut an end... its also a begininning, for that person and the people around them....people should die at there own will, under certian circumstances.

All will be well in the end

Update: http://www.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/europe...sia/index.html

I think there is a difference between not prolonging life through medical means and purposefully committing suicide. I think it is really up to God to decide when a person's life should end. None of us have the right to make that choice.

It's my understanding that the reason that the catholic church (and other religions) believe that sucide is the ultimate sin is that there is no possibility for redemption, as you are already dead, and there for you just punched a ticket straight to hell.....

Is sucide right? I think so. And not just for people who are in incredible pain. Back in Ancient times, the Romans had a rather postive view of suicide....of course they also had a word to describe the killing of every tenth person, so you have to take there additutes with a grain of salt.

I honestly believe your life is your own, and no one has the right to tell you how to live it, or how to end it. And that includes god. If god wants to stop suicide, he/she can end suffering, prevent depression, and stop chronic terminal illness.... Until he/she gets of his/her pedistal and starts to show some compassion for those who suffer, why should they have control over there destinies?

As for assisted suicide, I don't feel comfortable with that idea. Who knows what that persons last thoughts were? Maybe they wanted to live? Maybe they had a second thought? You don't know, I don't know, so neither one of us should be involved with ending anothers life. Now I am a realist, and I know it is physically impossible for some people to end there own lives, so its ok for you to help them with set up, but they have to flip the switch (my apologies for being flippant and crude) so to speak.....