Women of IT

I must post this from my real life observation having just filled an IT opening I had. Yeah it was a rough process and drawn out just sorting out resume's. I must say however that 20 something women have it over 20 something men. Why well try reading the book Women are vrom Venus Men are from Mars for a starter and then put almost 30 years into engineering and IT. Yes I gave some problem solving questions I found that the men reacted to the problem and thewomen responded. What do I mean by this simple they were given instructions on how to configure a workstation for our network, I watched theor progress via screen shots and keystrokes from another area. Didn't say I was not going to watch them now did I. Anyway there were about 36 items listed in order and they were told this is how we set up things here. The men were all over the list fist was see the network next form them was explore the network, oops jump back to list takes next favorite item configs it then poking around on the network again. The women however were more reasonable with their approach all three worked down the list from top to bottom most very quickly about 1/2 the amount of time the men took. The women did as they were asked, asked more questions were less boastful, the men strutted their stuff some even did things they were not asked to do just cause they could and wanted to prove it. Well all said and done I hired a very sharp young woman that in a few years will replace me cause I'm retiring. My advice to the men in IT get advice from the women in IT, Women in IT rock and are way more stable and mature in their 20's then men. I know this as fact cause I was 20 something a long time ago LOL. So my hat is off to all the women here never give up your all doing great jobs. And remember dudes I was on the wen when there was a web site call Babes of the Web there were 10 at one time. On a pure professional level give women their full due they earned it after all they have had to hear our **** for years LOL.

[Apologies in-advance for the broad generalities below... I know of many members here who fit none of the generalities mentioned below - these are just observations and, as stated, generalities that I've come to over my years in the industry)


Well, simply point of reference... women tend to be much more dedicated to their jobs, less egotistical and more team-oriented than most guys, I've noticed. However, at the same time, women are less likely to "think out of the box" and go about trying to hack or fix something that they know they know nothing about... while men, well, much like asking for directions they're less likely to ask for help until they are truely, 100% stumped.

So, if you are a procedurely-oriented shop (and most fast-paced businesses don't seem able to ever "get" there), women are marvelous at taking directions and doing just what the procedure says without getting "distracted."

However, men tend to be pioneers and innovators, even if it means doing things nothing like the procedure says to and breaking a few other things along the way to get something done. (they also tend to be less meticulous and write crappy, terse procedures - probably in the spirit of trying to get things done)

All good points. However Palemoon, are you saying that you watched how they performed without telling them? That sounds really invasive to me. I'm think that in my country(Australia) you have to notify employee's that they are being monitored.

i would just like to point out that ALL of those men/women discriptions are the exact oposite of what one would expect them to be. women are more right-brained. they tend tward the creative. this would make them MORE likely to "think out of the box" and give it a go at fixing something they know nothing about. men, on the other hand, are more left-brained. this makes them logical, which lends it-self quite well to procedure-oriented tasks. being more logical would make one less likly to attempt something they knew nothing about, as there would be no steps/procedure to attempt.

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Originally posted here by 8*B@LL
i would just like to point out that ALL of those men/women discriptions are the exact oposite of what one would expect them to be. women are more right-brained. they tend tward the creative. this would make them MORE likely to "think out of the box" and give it a go at fixing something they know nothing about. men, on the other hand, are more left-brained. this makes them logical, which lends it-self quite well to procedure-oriented tasks. being more logical would make one less likly to attempt something they knew nothing about, as there would be no steps/procedure to attempt.

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[WARNING: More personal opinions and far-reaching generalities ahead...]

Part of what throws that all off-kilter, however (esp. in the workplace) is that men tend more towards being more egotistical the further up the technical ladder they climb (though some of the true wizards, I must say, are the most humble folk I know); this tends to give them a "this can't defeat me" attitude and, thusly, a more out-of-the box approach...

Women, OTOH, tend to be very non-confrontational and very detail/procedure oriented, "not wanting to upset the apple cart," I guess. It's rare to hand a woman a procedure in the work place (in my experience) and have her go off, find a problem, but not come back and say "hey, what's up here?" or similiar... many men I've worked with, on the other hand, may just "power through it" and figure it out (or break it), and then have only a relatively 50/50 chance at coming back and telling me what the issue was, etc... though there definitely are always exceptions (and I have to admit that I've seen a fair amount of those, as well, to be fair).


It's counter-intuitive, I know, and the exact opposite of how people tend to handle their own personal relationships (think of how you (as in a "general" you, not as in "specifically 8*B@LL") act at work and think of how you act in a relationship with your husband/wife/significant other/parents/etc. I'm guessing that they're complete and total opposites... it's a weird human psychology (at least here in the US - I can't speak so much for other cultures, at least -- us Americans are a work all unto our own... ROFL)

Again, just my own personal observations/interpretations. YMMV.

Ah there is the point see they were told this is a test for employment, now don;t know about you but Test get reviewed now don't they otherwise how could I score. This fact excaped many of the men, I was out of sight, if they could not follow simple directions how can I trust them on a multimillion dollar network? Tests in and of them selves mean review and one can never assume by what means.

As the sole owner of a tech shop and as far as anyone can tell at this point, the only female tech for miles around I hear it all. Daily.

I agree with most if not all of the above from a general view point. Meaning, in general we as a gender behave a particular way.

And then you have the rebels. Personally, I see myself mostly as one of the rebels. I have a few of the general qualities listed above, non confrontational, etc but I do see out of the box. I've been able to trouble shoot circles around some other techs that have given up on a job and sent their customer to my shop just to get them off their back only to have me fix the problem.

There is one trait I've only encountered in the male of the species and that is the grandstanding. Why is it when some male techs encounter a female tech they do everything in their power to put her down? Case in point, no video on a brand new Dell. I troubleshot the issue per my customers request and was convinced it was the video card. I was in the field and not anticipating this problem and didn't have a spare video card with me. I called Dell after i knew what the problem was, got the RMA issued (that call is another post unto itself...hell desk employees should have some experience in my opinon. lol) and the Dell tech showed up three days later to drop in the vid card. He did nothing but put down my work. She knows nothing, this isnt' going to work, it's a mobo issue not a vid card issue...blah blah blah.
At least he had the good grace to shut up when the vid card fixed the problem. Grrrr..

Long, I know, but my situation lends itself to weird situations on a daily basis and sometimes I wonder if I wouldn't be better off being a cog in the corporate wheel someplace. :mad:

TC~~who's tired of strapping on armour to go to work everyday...

Very good point TC and you should not have to put on armour everyday it is pure nonsense to have to do so. That is the word I was looking for Grandstanding this is what the males seem to excel at. As for women thinking outside the box well gee seeing how in many cases they are not allowed inside the box their narture seems more inclined to think outside the box. Sorry corp life is one of set rules it is called making a living and haveing the company profitable keeps food on the table and a roof over the head. Following directions is part of life, not knowing anything of business operations how can one think they can make an inovation in the area? In short if things are not broke why fix them, the men tended to want to inovate in areas that required none, that is part of thinking outside the box. Here was another part of the test. They were given a box with a driver problem, would blue screen, next to the box were the install disks for everything to be re-loaded. They were asked to fix the box as fast as they could. The men being such inovators begain right away to wipe out the harddrive and do a re-install, iniovate and think outside the box they did not. The person I hired spent all of 10 minutes assessing the problem and fixing it. What did she do simply started in safe mode command line prompt and restore an old registry. Sometime the right answer requires no iniovation now does it, just one of those procedures one should go through. Women not being assertive is also false I did not want a yes person by any means and she asserted herself when it was called for when she defended her methods of how and why she did thing like she did. TC most likely understands more then most men here about thinking outside the box being inivoative, creative because just to get where she is at she has to go and do things prove things well beyond what any male tech does, that is unless the male tends to be objective and think outside the box and inivoate also in the true terms.

Thanks Palemoon...
I see a lot of good but it's still off kilter becouse when I do encounter a male tech (r/l, not the forums, that's always way different since they don't have to compete or work with me) that supports and works with me and not against me I find myself surprised. I had a field test for a new subcontractor and I told my husband that night, it was so cool..he was genuinely happy I aced it, I didn't get any grief, just lots of joy.

Maybe it's just the mood I'm in today and I'll stop my ranting about this particular issue now (no promises on anything else. :p )!

Palemoon, I'm sure your motives were good - it's just that kind of monitoring can be abused. But it sounds like you got the right person for the job.

I have found that I prefer to be helped out by a women in IT then by a guy. I know this is really generalising but in the last couple of jobs I've had it's been the case. At my last job there were 2 female IT people and 1 male. If anyone had a problem then they would always go to 1 of the girls because they were more approachable. They would come over, ask what the problem was and get to it. Afterwards they would offer advice if needed. The fella on the overhand would sought of accuse you of doing something on purpose. Remarks like "You did that did ya? Well geez..." and "What have you done this time?" was all that he said. My previous jobs were very similar - always go to the female techie.

bquine, he was only monitoring for the job interview and that is perfectly legit. Most people, myself included do not do very well when someone is breathing down their neck. This way he could let them work but see how they went about it. I like it! :D

When you put it like that it sounds like an advantage. Still, I'd be one of those who would want to know. I've never gone for a job in tech so please excuse my ignorance.

Men are less inclined than women to ask for help
because there is no positive reinforcement for it.
The supervisor will act annoyed and put it on your
record that you "lack initiative" and your "skills are weak"

It's the same reason women ask for directions when they're
lost, and men don't. Women have learned by experience
that, most of the time, some nice person will help them out.
Men only encounter hostility.

It's the same on these forums.
If "Damsel_in_Distress" comes on and says "Please help me..."
all these chivalrous guys want to help.
but if some adolescent male has the same problem,
it's "RTFM, loser!"
:cool:

Good point rcgreen!

I will say this...I don't need positive reinforcement, could care less if someone says, hey..way to go on whatever..but just don't get nitpicky over stupid stuff. Goes both ways, guys and gals.

As far as falling all over themselves when a D in D hits the board, I've seen it and I've recieved the PM's and all I can do is move on. I rate a person on their skill level and their attitdue not on their sex or looks.

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Originally posted here by TechieChick
As the sole owner of a tech shop and as far as anyone can tell at this point, the only female tech for miles around I hear it all. Daily.

I agree with most if not all of the above from a general view point. Meaning, in general we as a gender behave a particular way.

And then you have the rebels. Personally, I see myself mostly as one of the rebels. I have a few of the general qualities listed above, non confrontational, etc but I do see out of the box. I've been able to trouble shoot circles around some other techs that have given up on a job and sent their customer to my shop just to get them off their back only to have me fix the problem.

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Actually TC, I'll say publically that you were one of the aforementioned "exceptions" I, personally, was speaking of... that is, many of the generalities don't necessarily fit you. (and, no, not trying to "kiss ass" here or anything - I think TC probably knows what I'm getting at, etc)

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There is one trait I've only encountered in the male of the species and that is the grandstanding. Why is it when some male techs encounter a female tech they do everything in their power to put her down? [...] At least he had the good grace to shut up when the vid card fixed the problem. Grrrr..

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Yeah, I lumped this all in with "ego." You are exactly right... and yeah, women do seem to get an unfair shake in the whole "who knows what" sort of competition, if you know what I mean. Probably because the egotistical, boastful male can talk and talk and talk, and the typical non-confrontational female, for the most part, will back down and "take it." Kind of reminds me of the whole sort of "alpha male" domination that goes on in prides of lions (and it can probably be just as vicious, I'd venture).

But, to a certain point, I think there's another point in the technical world in-particular, where techs figure out that "they know all this and they can figure out all this other stuff without much more effort." But, they're actually not experienced enough to realize what they don't know. So, you get all this egotistical BS that's led by a decent technical knowledge, to begin with... but it stops at some point and the lack of wisdom actually shines through. (not really sure how to better explain what I'm thinking here at the moment)

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Originally posted here by rcgreen
[...]It's the same on these forums.
If "Damsel_in_Distress" comes on and says "Please help me..."
all these chivalrous guys want to help.
but if some adolescent male has the same problem,
it's "RTFM, loser!"
:cool:

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LOL.... yeah, you're right... in both fronts. Good comparison, too.

(at some point I had discussed with others (you know who you are) about "proving" that fact here... but, in the end we all just laughed about it and decided it was probably a moot point)

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But, to a certain point, I think there's another point in the technical world in-particular, where techs figure out that "they know all this and they can figure out all this other stuff without much more effort." But, they're actually not experienced enough to realize what they don't know. So, you get all this egotistical BS that's led by a decent technical knowledge, to begin with... but it stops at some point and the lack of wisdom actually shines through. (not really sure how to better explain what I'm thinking here at the moment)

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:D Just yesterday I told a client that if they ever encountered a tech that said they knew everything there was to know about computers to run away!
I'll be the first to step up and say that there is a whole lot I don't know yet, BUT...I will say this, I'm smart enough to figure out how to figure it out and I'm not to shy to ask.

Mr. Wizard..thanks for the comments, I appreciate them. ;)