One Step Closer to War???

Today Tony Blair submitted evidence to the British Parliment,in an emergency session,which shows concrete evidence of Iraq possessing and researching weapons of mass destruction.Is this enough to sway the skeptics?I hope so.It is said that these weapons can be armed and on their way to their given destination in as little as 45 minutes.Some of the weapons are relatively short range,but can go far enough to hit Israel,and some of them are longer range(I haven't seen the specs,but I imagine that means they can at least reach the closer parts of Europe.Considering that Saddam has now told another bold face lie to the world,and violated the restrictions put on him by the UN,he needs to be removed from office and disarmed.As far as just taking his weapons away again,I think even the thought is rediculous.He's proven to the world that he isn't trustworthy enough for that.He'll just start the development process over again,until one day he is able to develop these weapons and launch them without the UN taking notice.(Until they're in the air anyway).I feel the world(not just the UN),has a duty to send troops in there and get this psychotic dictator out of office and remove all WMD from the country.He's a threat to everyone.Not just the US and Israel.Not even just those that oppose his regime.Ask yourself this.Would you want him as an ally if you led a country?Do you think if he saw some benefit in launching a barrage of missiles into your country he would hold back(ally or not)?I don't think so.Whether the rest of the world backs us or not,I feel the time has come to get this done and get it done the right way.Meaning kill Saddam,kill any resistance that tries to ally with him,destroy his weapons,and do what needs to be done to stabalize the Iraqi government.Enough is enough.Here's a link to Tony Blair's presentation to Parliment.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,63915,00.html

I don't know if you noticed, but CNN just stated the National terror threat level is being lowered from 'high' to 'elevated.'

Just some good news to all. Keep an eye on CNN.COM because they have not announced the details as of yet.

Makes you think why BLAIR showed the evidence!!
Why could'nt Bush have shown what is going on.....Give it 24 hrs and see if the English parliament goes along with what is on show??


The time frame of the evidence of Nuclear weapons has gone from 3 Months(Bush's words a few weeks ago) to 12 months (Powell's words very recently) and now we have in the report from Blair..1-2 yrs!!
It gets longer and longer...

If the speaches remained staight maybe the world would see a perfect picture??
Until then...There are a lot of questions still to be asked and many avenues of Discussions to be takin before any action is needed.

With that being said, it looks like a done deal. The only thing left to do is get ourselves prepared for this gruesome task spiritually.

To help with that im posting this link:

Up-Lifting

I always wonder where the logic is in this.

Terrorists killed thousands of our innocent citizens.

So we plan to kill millions of innocent citizens?

For those who see the logic.

www.notinourname.net
www.nion.us

-Keisha

Quote:

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So we plan to kill millions of innocent citizens?

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Who's planning to "kill millions of innocent citizens"? Try not to be so dramatic.

The logic is prevention. To prevent a madman from using weapons that WILL kill millions of innocent citizens. He has the weapons, and he's working on aquiring more weapons.

The goal of the UN here, is to stop Saddam from using these horrible weapons on innocent people. War with Saddam now, could mean millions of lives saved in the future.

There's the logic.

Listen, I'm no war monger. I detest the thought of war. I really do. But sometimes things like this need to be done. No matter how ugly they are. That's what I believe.

The time frame for Saddam being able to develop nuclear weapons has changed,but the fact remains that he IS developing them.The main reason the time frame has changed is because of the fact that the head of his nuclear development team quit working for him,and is now working for US intelligence teams to stop him,not because of some government deception conspiracy.As far as the US killing millions of innocent citizens,first let me ask who is innocent?The soldiers forced to fight allied forces by Saddam's regime,the 12 year old kids that are given an AK47 and a hand grenade and sent after US soldiers by the Iraqi government?Lets get real here who's killing the innocent civi's?The allied forces or the government leaving the allied forces no choice but to kill these people,the same government that tests chemical and biological weapons on these innocent people,the same government that if given the chance would drop a nuke on anyone who doesn't follow their reign of terror.Let me ask another question of the people against this war.Should we stand by and let him develop these weapons?Should we let Israel be destroyed by the terrorists because they are Jewish?Is it really logical to put the lives of you,your family,your friends,and millions of others to let an insane dictator stay in power?It may be in your mind,but not in mine.These people are untrustworthy,specifically target innocent civilians,and are willing to do anything to bring down anyone who supports Israel,and/or the US.


Having now read the document submitted by Tony Blair,I stand my ground even more firmly on the subject.It seems to me there is absolutely no question whatsoever that Saddam is an extreme threat to the entire world.There is absolutely no reason to have tons upon tons of chemical and biological agents(including VX one of the most deadly nerve agents ever created,it was stated that 10mL will kill a person within seconds),unless you intend to wreak havoc on everyone around you.You do the math.30000 tons of VX 10 mL per person,who's looking to kill millions of people?That's not including the similarly large amounts of mustard gas,anthrax,botulism toxin,aflatoxin,and a number of other agents as well as the means to deliver them,and currently developing the technology to send his missiles to the far end of Europe.

THe time frame has changed because he has not been able to get the needed material... I believe the President said if he were left alone and the sanctions lifted he could have a nuclear device inside of a few months ( that was when people from all over were calling for an end to the sanctions in exchange for a return of the UN weapons inspectors) The time frame has now been set at 6-18 months (last I heard) and that is with all sanctions in place... The report Tony Blair released today makes a very good case for war with Iraq... I will include it with this post in PDF... Like Sgt B and others have said I do not want a war with Iraq... That said it has to be done... The Germans likened President Bush to Hitler the other day... They made a mistake... They should have likened Saddam to Hitler... Today after the release of the report by Blair the Iraqis said that this was all a "campaign of lies to further the zionist agenda." Sounds a loy like the c**p Hitler used to spew... the jews are to blame for all of the worlds troubles... It was BS then and it is BS now... Will millions die in a war with Iraq??? That is always possible but IF it does happen there will be one person to blame... Saddam... because he has been known to put military command centers inside hospitals, schools, residences... The people of Iraq are not blameless in this as many would say... They could have rose up and taken him out after the Gulf war if they wanted but they didn't... Yes he would have killed a great deal of them but he could not kill them all now could he... As it stands now IMHO Saddam will be killed and replaced in a war with Iraq and the US will rebuild the nation as we have done after every war we have fought... The only way "millions" will die is if Sadam orders the use of NBC weapons against either us or Isreal... In which case I would imagine the temperature in Bagdad is going to reach 5000 degrees in a little less than a nano second... And will it be deserved? Yes it will IMHO... he has shown time and again he WILL use WMD and if he uses them against the US, UK troops or Isreal then he is commiting suicide for his entire country....

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The only way "millions" will die is if Sadam orders the use of NBC weapons against either us or Isreal... In which case I would imagine the temperature in Bagdad is going to reach 5000 degrees in a little less than a nano second.

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Some people might not belive you, but I heard (and I wish I still had the article or some proof) that Israel stated that they will use nukes in a heartbeat. If one SCUD missle flies at them, then they are launching.

I've also heard of people comparing Bush to Hitler, and it really makes me sick. I think he's a damn fine President, and I'm glad he's in office right now.

It was on fox news last night that the Isreali defense minister said that they would get involved if Saddam launched against them... He would not confirm that they would use nukes but he did hint at by saying "if they (Iraq) use chemical or biologic agents against Isreal then hell will be unleashed against them." Knowing Saddams track record I would give Isreal about a week after hostilites begin before they are hit...

the point isn't if he has 'the bomb' or not. This has never been the issue. thats not the only weapon of mass destruction that he can and will use to kill our family and friends.

the point is, there are ways we can protect our troops from germ and chemical attack but nothing can be done to protect them from a nuclear blast. action must be taken right away.

Just a little different angle with which to look at the whole Blair news conference. It seems that yesterday Al Gore made a speech in CA where he denounced the entire war on Iraq, saying that we should focus on our unfinished business in Afghanistan. Now for those of you who don't know, by votes alone, Gore should have been president rather than Bush, and is still Bush's biggest problem, politically speaking, in the US. Gore's comments had the White House up in arms, calling him a "hack" who is "out of touch" with the rest of American sentiment, which is at best a huge exageration. This move into Iraq is NOT unilaterally supported in the US, and Gore was speaking for a very large number of Americans when he made his speech. It just seems ironic that Blair suddenly has all of this proof now to support Bush. We have seen before the "hand in hand" behaviour of the US and Britain. I just wonder if a well placed phone call from Mr. Bush didn't push Blair into making his sudden announcement. I would like to see some proof of what they are trying to shove down American and British throats right now.


Deb ;)

In 1991 Gore was saying that we should finish the war in Iraq and that by not doing so then we would going back in... In 2000 He said again that Iraq was a clear and present danger to the security of the whole region... Now he is saying wait... Don't go just yet... And that Bush is not listening to the people... This is the same guy who said he wouldn't fight the elections in FL yet did just that for weeks causing Bush to do the same and the people to lose confidence in the election process as if it wasn't down enough... this is the same Gore who wanted to throw out approximatly 11,000 absetee ballots from service men and women overseas because they had an APO address instead of a street address... No matter which way you feel about the war the best man for the job is running the show IMO... If we had a Sore/Looserman Presidency the American people would have been lucky if we tossed a couple of Tomahawks into Afganistan... And Blair has been saying for over a month that he was going to give the people of the UK evidence against Saddam...

Ask and ye shall receive. Here is the pdf version of the British dossier, which is supposed to detail Iraq's weapons buildup. This is an interesting read, to say the least. I won't push my opinion here, but rather leave you all to form your own.

I try to stay out of political debate because it's a really quick way to kill your reputation, However on this occasion i'm going to throw in my 2p worth.

*** Warning the next rant solely represents my opinion, and should not be read as fact ***

The dossier released by Tony and chums today contained a large amount of solid evidence from 5 years ago, mixed with massive ammounts of speculation. We were treated to circumstantial evidence of the highest order.

The long range missiles that we were warned about seemed to come from a pre war programme, and a blurred photo. This is not evidence of the ability to throw nukes at Washington, or London. (I'm simplifiing slightly because I don't have the time, or will, to go into centrifuges, or purchases of enriched Uranium in Africa.)

I do not feel that Blair provided us with any compelling evidence that we have the right to wage war on Iraq.

However .....

The plight of the Kurds after their botched uprising resulting from their belief that the allies were going to go into Bagdad, or the harrowing images of streets filled with corpses left after WMD attacks on Iraqi people IS a compelling reason to find Saddam and put a bullet into his brain (after due proccess)

And here's where I get contentious

I firmly believe that George Bush Snr, and the then British Prime Minister (John Major) should be tried as accessories to these crimes against humanity as they allowed them to happen.

The west has known for years that Saddam has been trying to become a major force in the area, and that he's a murderous bastard. (but nothing was done) so what's the sudden hurry ???

I applaud George Bush's plans for a regime change in Iraq, but not his methods. We have seen the rights of his own people erroded in the name of "national security interests" and the general use of bullying tactics towards getting his own way. Flame away people, but I tend to agree with the german Govt, I think George Bush has used social tactics traditionally associated with certain German Dictators. (***but give me credit, I don't think he's about to commit genocide ***)

So if you read this George ... please kill him, but try not to kill too many others in the process (Our boys, or Iraq's).

If you don't like what i've written ... death threats, flames, and Negs to

Saddam Hussain
Presidential Palace
Bagdad
Iraq

Regards.

My opinion is simple: We should have took our Iraq when we had the chance, and in some case's, it is coming back to bite us in the a$$. I don't believe that Bush is a bad president, I do believe that he has made a few mistakes, but that's my opinion. Also, have we ever had a perfect president making perfect decisions and being an all around wise old man? No, nobody's perfect. When people criticise the President, saying they could do a better job, then go to college, study politics, run for office, and (hopefully) make it. Then, when people are questioning you and have no faith in you, you'll understand how Bush feels. I think (IMO) he is doing a good job, however I do agree that maybe we shoulda finished the job earlier, and finished the job in afganistan. Again, this post is JMHO. I'm willing to read any other's as I am deeply into politics. Thank you! :) -- Jason Copeland

Oh, and as for israel, the only way I can see them entering this war is if Iraq pulls a persian gulf on them and tries to draw them in. In that case, we would beat them either way, IMO. By trying to draw another country into a war, which could possibly lead to WW3, other arab countries will hopefully see that Iraq obviously wants people to help them by doing anything to get that, and hopefully they will realize that Iraq doesn't want peace if it want's to get other's in the fight. Again, JMO.

Well, I have decided to open a conference room to discuss this furthur. Why? Because you can't assign AP's in the conference rooms. This way everyone will be able freely express thier opinions. Here is the room info.

It is room number 72 and is named War. Your key to get in is za9418ja9ko42

Maybe then we can all really state what is on our minds w/o having to worry about AP's.

I tried to enter the room, to no avail. I really want to join, so can you PM me the room key and blah blah. Basically, can you invite me into it through pm? Like I said, I tried using the room number and room key, but it didn't work. Thanks! :) -- Jason Copeland

ya just send me a pm and i'll give you a key. That goes for anyone interested in having an actual say without having to worry about AP's. that is what the conference rooms are for.

Sorry people came of age in the 60's and well are a few of us around. Frankly I've seen this about 3 times in my life now. Media spin spin doctors weave such nobile causes that we as mothers and fathers send our sons and daughters off to fight because we believe. Peace is a hard path, difference in culture as well. I sit around and see some of the most well known corporations in this country now in question over ethics something that should be learned in kindergarden, and attention diverted to a people, way of life and a man I cannot say I understand. I am without work I have children I am over 40 my middle son has a chance to be drafted if this continues. Value is placed first in the home if we cannot take care of probems here then we cannot lead the world. I designed a T-shirt on the front is Americans speak here on the back is a target with All Else Shoot Here. I am sad cause it is my own damn goverment taking aim there.

Peace

The conference is still going strong.. if anybody needs a key PM me.