AP System Suggestion

Yea, this post was supposed to go onto the end of this: http://www.antionline.com/showthread...0&pagenumber=1

but the thread was closed, so just piece it all together :D

ok, so we could setup a system for war games and earn AP's by that. but what about the poor saps that come here to learn and dont know how to break honeypots etc.

ok, fair enough, it might be a good idea, but you would still have to have the same AP system aswell as your wargames theory. otherwise, if it was just a wargames, this site would become ever more of a place where people only use to get good Ap's.... even though this site is now, without other people keeping everyone else in check it would really be pointless... you may as well change the site domain to 'ap-o-rama'

as a further note. perhaps (15 - 20) member at AO, could be like an AP moderator. for example, someone might neg a person for trivial BS and thats how people get upset and flames start happening. however, instead of that AP assignment going directly to the person, it could go to an 'AP Mod' and screened to see if its worthy. this will prevent flame wars and alliances. and that would make everyone alot happier...

any volentiers? i know i would be...

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instead of that AP assignment going directly to the person, it could go to an 'AP Mod' and screened to see if its worthy. this will prevent flame wars and alliances. and that would make everyone alot happier...

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Now thats sounds like a darn good idea. :thumbsup: to that.

I don't think you have any idea of the amount of antipoint assignments that fly around here daily... You'd need 1,500 people to check them all... I'm still in favor of the 'report this antipoint assignment to a moderator', though...

just because there are so many in one day, doesnt mean that it has to arrive the same day it was sent. it could even be delayed a week or so... then if the work really get piled up, someone could shutdown the AP system for a little while until its cleared...

like most ideas its a working process :D

[edit] even limite the amount of assignments a person has per day? [/edit]

I don't think it would be appropriate to have site members as antipoint moderators simply because of the conflict of interest. Obviously something you thought about:

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any volentiers? i know i would be...

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I just don't see it working: those members would cease to be negged since they can see all the information about the assignments, and they would wield (IMO) too much power over the running of the site. Considering the importance some people currently place on antipoints.

And on Negative's 'report assignment to an antipoint moderator' idea: a hell of a lot of people would do that for every negative antipoint they got, reasonable or not, and I imagine they'd get swamped under just as quickly. And if you had 15-20 moderators, there would be some big differences in opinion on what is appropriate and what is not as far as antipoint assignments are concerned. As people have stated in the past, one of the sole benefits of the antipoint system is the minimal amount of spam on this board. If ap's for spamming posts had to wait in a queue before taking effect, then this benefit would be greatly reduced.

You could always get rid of antipoints and select a whole lot of new moderators, like every other board on the Internet.

powertoad, everyone in individual, i mean. no matter what it is, you will always have people with different ideas.

thats why some posts get negged and greened by different people. it would be the same principal for this ap moderator.

maybe there should be a board from jupman who can screen particular applicants.

but with the security vs power thing, maybe the ap mods dont need to see any information (ie, who its from and who its going to but just the message itself, whether its green or red. and the post it came from./

--You know, im not a complete idiot...some pieces are missing--

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powertoad, everyone in individual, i mean. no matter what it is, you will always have people with different ideas.

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Newsflash :) What I mean, is that if you have antipoint moderators with wildly different ideas about what is appropriate and what is not, then you'll likely have to deal with complaints about how someone was treated more lightly than you because a different moderator screened their ap's. In the past it was JP who looked at the assignments, 1 person = no-one complaining about unfair treatment.

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but with the security vs power thing, maybe the ap mods dont need to see any information (ie, who its from and who its going to but just the message itself, whether its green or red. and the post it came from.

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That makes far more sense as far as what the moderator can see, but you would still be swamped under very quickly and I feel a large queue would build up almost immediately.

powertoad,

i can understand where you are comming from.

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if you have antipoint moderators with wildly different ideas about what is appropriate and what is not

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that is why we would need a screening process for the applicants. the mods shoudnt have control over how much damage each assignment does, just whether it should go through or not. and if someone goes lightly or too heavy, the tuff, because its not like its going to go throuh the same person all the time, it would be spread out over many people who have different ideas.

besides, would you rather it be treated differently and not gone through if it was a ned, then a greenie, or would you rather then to all go through.

as i have learnt from human nature, i could almost guarantee that the majority of negs (the unjust ones) will not go through and the majority or greens, however unjust, will probably go through.

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In the past it was JP who looked at the assignments, 1 person = no-one complaining about unfair treatment.

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you cant tell me that JP moderated ALL assignments, and we may not have to monitor all assignments either. hmmm... maybe there is a way to define the intesity of an assignment, and only those can be moderated. you never hear complaints about a neg that took off a couple of points, you only hear about that ones that do real damage.

is there any way to screen those against little ones?

[QUOTE] Originally posted here by Element_Epsilon
that is why we would need a screening process for the applicants.
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Even if we have a screening process.. who are you going to get to do it? There are many reasons why this isn't completely feasible but the biggest one is definately the lack of man power. I haven't been around a long time, but I can tell ya that no one will allow new-comers like you to be AP mods, no one knows who you are and no one trusts you. Most of the senior members and the few addicts that would be good for the job are just too busy. They have full time jobs (and we all know that computers-related professions don't fall with-in the standard 40 hrs/week category) and the rest are students (students don't have time for anything....). So regardless... if it's a good idea or not... it would never fly. You are basically setting up a small claims court system.... and anyone who's been in the real world knows how backed up those can be.

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no one knows who you are and no one trusts you

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sorry, but sometimes i forget what site this is and i forget that i changed my nick. if you look at my signature and follow those links. you will indeed find that i was, and in spirit still am Trust_Not_123 who is a respected senior member at AO.

[edit] see these posts:

http://www.antionline.com/showthread...hreadid=243281

and

http://www.antionline.com/showthread...hreadid=243295

[/edit]

I like this idea, I myself was negged for posting in Tech Humor. The person did not give a reason so I have tried the "Contact this person" thing. Having the anit-points will make it easier to know who to ask when security questions arise. Since it is likely that the knoledgeable people will have "legions of Leprechauns trying to steal that shiny pot of positve AnitPoints" :-)

HTRegz

I am Also available to do the job...

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as i have learnt from human nature, i could almost guarantee that the majority of negs (the unjust ones) will not go through and the majority or greens, however unjust, will probably go through.

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This isn't supporting your argument :).

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besides, would you rather it be treated differently and not gone through if it was a ned, then a greenie, or would you rather then to all go through.

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If this board is going to keep antipoints, I'd rather they all went through. When you think about it, if you want to have antipoint moderation to this extent (I'm thinking you would need guidelines for the proposed antipoint moderators) then there's no point in having antipoints, as they are something that could be awarded by following the guidelines, i.e. your opinion is not really of concern, because it will either fit in with the guidelines or it won't. If it doesn't, it will be rejected. You could have someone go through and 'mark' all the posts based on the guidelines and achieve the same thing, except nothing will be missed.

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you cant tell me that JP moderated ALL assignments, and we may not have to monitor all assignments either. hmmm... maybe there is a way to define the intesity of an assignment, and only those can be moderated. you never hear complaints about a neg that took off a couple of points, you only hear about that ones that do real damage.

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What I meant was when there was a problem, or abuse occurred, he was the only person who looked into it.

If you look at JP's first post on antipoints, he states that an old, respected member might even deal out a mighty seven antipoints with each assignment :D, when nowadays people can assign upwards of 70 antipoints. So then what is real damage, is it 10 negs, 20 greens, more? Say you're on the top 10 list and you lose 10 antipoints, that's not a big deal, but then if you're actually on 10 antipoints and you lose them all, it is a big deal. Maybe code to calculate relative impact of assignment on user.

HAH... sorry dude..... the walking floppy really should have given it away.. I guess I'm kinda tired.... wasn't expecting to see your return this quickly.... Anways nice new name... and yeah you definately are a respected member.. but still that makes 1 out of a fair amount that you would need to adequately handle the job.

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If you look at JP's first post on antipoints, he states that an old, respected member might even deal out a mighty seven antipoints with each assignment , when nowadays people can assign upwards of 70 antipoints. So then what is real damage, is it 10 negs, 20 greens, more? Say you're on the top 10 list and you lose 10 antipoints, that's not a big deal, but then if you're actually on 10 antipoints and you lose them all, it is a big deal. Maybe code to calculate relative impact of assignment on user.

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yea, but now your talking about how to AP system works now... hehe, just some questions cant be answered :D

HTRegz,

yea, no worries.

but like i was saying, thats why wee need more than just one. but in the end, it is alot of work, and if it needs to be dont at all it needs to be done right...

anyways, maybe we can still think of other ways to figure a new system out.. or at least modify the old one. perhaps that we can add a link beside the "contact user about assignment" for people to complain and then an AP mod could look into those ones..

that way only the ones people complain about get seen... but then people would likely to complain on all negs... BAH!

hehe, we will figure something out :D

How about we work with part of your idea....

It seems to me, and correct me if i'm wrong, but most of the problems arise from newbies who are playing with the AP system, possibly to upset the order of AO, possibly because they are uninformed.. How about an AP mod who recieves a random sampling of new members assignments. It isn't the greatest system because you could recieve only positive looking assignments, but based on odds it would allow you to definately cut down on the problems. Sometimes you don't have to solve the problem, just find a way to limit it. Everytime a new member signs up they are put on a grace period, where for a month, or two, or however long is decided.. a certain percentage of the APs they assign are sent to a mod. As for more senior members and people who have just been around longer, take a very small percentage of their assignments as the assumption would be they don't need to be babysat as much.

This may not be the greatest solution.. but perhaps it's a way of finding a happy-medium until a permant solution comes forward, and it doesn't require a great deal of man-power. (woman-power).. just one person who's willing to scan a few AP assignments every day.

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Originally posted here by Negative
I don't think you have any idea of the amount of antipoint assignments that fly around here daily... You'd need 1,500 people to check them all... I'm still in favor of the 'report this antipoint assignment to a moderator', though...

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I'll second that motion......

ok people.

so where does that leave us? if we are going to put forward a suggestion like this, then i recommend that we put all our heads together and sort it out all good and dandy before we give it to someone important enough to do something, but not so important not to give a damn :P

Well I like the Antipoint moderator thingie too... as well the assigning ap's via moderators.

I know this though, If one of these is coming through , our only two active mods ( Negative and MsMittens) would get swamped in no time.
So my suggestion to JUPM is to replace the mods who aren't active around here anymore, with new moderators.
Then go through with the ap-assigning via mods.
Each mod would evaluate the ap's in his forum, that way there aren't too much mods, they wouldn't get swamped,
and we have more control on the forums.....

I think this one could do the trick....

Greetz,

Nice idea shreks.... hehe, like your new avatar too.

wonder if i can be a mod on my new account... cause i still am a restected senior member :D

but yea, i think that these have been very good ideas and we might just be able to pull them off :D

does anyone have any suggestions on how we are going to set this up though??

Well,

As far as i know ... this would be easy to setup.
The new Mod assigning would take about ten minutes via their adminpanel, and
the redirection of AP-assignments, well that needs to be done in the code I think.
I bet JUPM has enough insight and experience now to pull this one of....

Thnx Trustie, but still I'm still jealous at your avatar though.... :D

Greetz,

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wonder if i can be a mod on my new account... cause i still am a restected senior member

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TN123 - No offense, but i wouldnt really classify you as a "respected senior member".
Fair enough you had over 400 posts, thus giving you senior status, but i could think of ALOT more members that actually would deserve this title!

AP System - Hows about we just let JupMedia decide.

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but i could think of ALOT more members that actually would deserve this title!

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so i wasnt the most deserving person...actually, lets not go down that road.. i know where it ends... in pain!

so lets get back to the task on hand. how do we get jupman media to look at the post and see what they say?

I think intmon is online a lot , i think he'll see it by itself...
Anyway you always could pm him...

Greetz,

Heh, watch it neg, MSM, ennis, i think they are after your jobs :p

Better use a remote shell in future :D


Cheers.

LOL @ Instronics,

Negative and MsM are both active and good mods, they go ... I go ;)

Greetz,