End Task Explorer in Win 98

Hey guys. I'm gonna share something I noticed, and maybe you can tell me if it's safe or not...

It started when I checked my system resources. Then I got an illegal operation in Explorer, end tasked it, and then checked my system resources again. They had gone up. So I did a little testing...

I took everything out of my msconfig startup and restarted. After a clean restart with nothing running I had 88% free system resources. So I ran a bunch of programs (Kazaa, Winamp, etc.), then closed all of them so nothing was running again, and checked my resources. It was at 83%. So I control alt deleted, and end tasked Explorer. After waiting for the dialog box asking me to wait or end task, I end tasked it, and checked my resources. 84%... It went up and I didn't restart.

I was wondering why my system resources stayed at 83% even after I had closed everything. Any know why?

Also, is this safe? I was told that it's dangerous to end task Explorer, even though there clearly was no problem. I could have programs like AIM, and Internet Explorer running while I do this, and they stay open. So this could be useful if you want to free up resources without restarting.

Any comments/explanations?

Thanks,
Ramzi

I could be wrong, but I remember reading that windows keeps programs in memory, or has memory dedicated to even closed applications. Then when it needs more virtual memory it closes down the saved areas to open up more memory. WindowsME was the worst one for this, and it never seemed to clear out the now unused memory allocations.

As to why your system resources were still at 83% even after you closed everything is because I believe that there are still threads, or processes that are still working even when explorer is closed. There are also things there in your memory.

The only problem with end tasking explorer.exe is you close out the gui interace in windows. Its not dangerous. Only if your some new computer user. But even then you can still restart the computer and it will be back.

If your running windows XP you have and option to restart explorer.exe or other processes.

cheyenne1212 closing explorer doesn't close the gui interface permanently, it will automatically restart a second or less later, I don't know whether the same applies to xp though.

The only way that i have found to free up resources like ram once a program is closed is to use a third party piece of software that monitors when things close and frees up the resources that they were using as windows is so bad at this.

Actually ShippMA that is not always true about explorer.exe restarting. It is SUPPOSED to restart when it crashes, but sometimes that does not always work and you can get stuck. Now I haven't run Windows 98 in a LONG time, so I don't remember if you can get to any sort of RUN if you press Ctrl+Alt+Del whenever explorer.exe does not restart.

In Windows XP there is still the same problem. I know though if you hit Ctrl+Alt+Del the task manager will come up and you can get a RUN dialog box to restart explorer.exe.

In general Windows98 (or really all OS that are not built off of an NT platform) does not manage memeory correctly. It might be able to reassign alloctated memory again once it's free, or might not be able to reasign all of it. But then again there are always ups and downs with every OS.

Personally I like Windows XP because I think it brings the best of both works. The stability and management of an NT platform, but also will let you play your games like Windows 98 and such. Because I've tried those third party software applications before for OSes like Windows 98 and I have never really noticed anything great about them. Plus I don't like the fact that I have to use MORE resources to run a app just to be able to be able to clean out my RAM. I'd rather let the OS do that and take less resources up that way.

Just a thought,
~AciD

wow i wish i knew what was going on...lol

Hmmm.. I think the concept of Paging plays a role here.When u start a application(winamp etc.) the requires pages of that application comes to our main memory(RAM i think so..) and stays their untill u request a new application.Pure demand paging only brings those pages into the memory which r needed for the runnng process.When new application starts the old pages are replaced by the new ones using Page Replacement algols or Free frame algols.So that's why I think System Resources gets a bit consumed.

I didn't say it closed it out permanently, but I have never seen a Win 98 machine automatically bring back explorer.exe if you end task it. I have seen it bring it back after it crashed only a couple times, but usually by then you have to restart the comptuer because everything else has screwed up.

As far as the memory it seems like win 98, ME, ect effectively handle only 256 MB of ram. After that it cannot handle the extra ram efficiently. However, like AciDriveHB said OS's built off of a NT platform like 2000, XP ect will effictively handle the memory.

OK here is a possabliity..

How have you set the Virtual memory? (I have had customers running fixed Swap file size have resource problems) best set to "Let Windows Manage" (esp if the Explorer.exe error mentions anything to do with "Pageing).

A clean install of Win 98 normaly has 90-95% free resources.. Some of the runonce progs during the startup will cause a drop in resources after start.. also watch out for TSR's running in the autoexec. or even funny setting in the config.sys..

having said all that .. and to restate what has already been said.. Win9x memory management SUX.

An extra comment.. I may have missed a comment.. But.. Explorer.exe IS a core to the WIN OS.. The GUI.. you may find some things won't work so well with it out of the show.. PSE software guru's wher I am wrong here PSE


Cheers

Here's the thing though, I don't understand why under 98 that you have resource problems whenever you set a page file size rather than letting Windows do it. I personally have tried to set a size and it runs slower, even though the same setup under XP runs better.

A deeper explination of what I mean. Does it not make sense to statically set the size of your page file, that way it's one large chunk? What windows does by default is uses the min size of your page file on your hard drive... but whenever it needs more space and goes to the max size, it then has to use more space off the hard drive. So really part of your page file could be at the start of your hard drive (well after where Windows itself is installed at least), then the other part would be at the end of your hard drive. So it has to search both pieces trying to find both. What I do is take and set the min size and max size to the same thing (the magic number seems to be 3 times the amount of RAM in the system) and put that at the start of a freshly formatted secondary drive.

To me that would maximize proformance, and on Windows XP it does. But on Windows 98 it doesn't. Anyway I thought I would bring it up since I thought about it whenever Und3ertak3r made the comment:

Quote:

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I have had customers running fixed Swap file size have resource problems

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Sorry if I got off track a little, just was wondering if anyone tried the same thing or might have a logical reasoning for why.

~AciD

So... Does this mean it's safe to do what I said?

well.....if I were you I wouldn't close explorer...or "systray"...actually I never close anything I don't recognize unless I absolutly have to. But as long as you don't close stuff that's vital to the OS then you should be safe. Just find out which programs are vital and don't close those. Also, there's a better way to monitor your computer's performance. There's a tool that I'll post a link to in a minute.

-edit-
It's called Si Meter and it monitors a whole lot of stuff, but on the down side it *does* use up some resources but it doesn't seem to use much. The link is http://www.simeter.com/ and the program was recently endorsed by the show "The Screen Savers".

Thanks for the effort, but I use Windows 98 and this program isn't compatible with that.

You CAN close explorer.exe and systray, but who knows what might happen. It seems that Windows 98 reacts differently everytime you do something like End Task on it. Just make sure if you do it a lot, to do a system defragmentation now and then also. Because I have a feeling that End Task probably throws 98 out of control.

The only down side to End Tasking explorer.exe is if the OS won't reload it and you can't get to a run command to run it, then you have to totally restart your system.

Just a thought...
~AciD