Problem with OLD system (BIOS gone??)

My gf has an old, old system, I can't recall what type of system but it has an old-school IBM Motherboard and some Opti chips (I'm just picking up hardware knowledge from my friends, so I don't know what most of this stuff is). I can get more info if you need it though. There is no "BIOS" per se that we can find on the Motherboard (looking for a BIOS as a small box with switches) so I was told that the BIOS may have been on the Hard Drive (just formatted before this trouble started), is there a way to retrieve it? Perhaps download a Bios for the Hard Disk?

Your question is a bit unclear. Do you have a complete system? Does it power up? What happens next? Does the machine boot at all? If so what happens next? Is it old as in a 386 or 486 processor. Some details about the machine would enable a better understanding of what the problem actually is, or is worth spending time on

The BIOS is a chip on the motherboard its self. When you first turn the computer on, the first thing you see flashing across the screen is the BIOS. Usually to enter it, you press Delete, F1, F10. Something like that.

So as long as the motherboard works, the BIOS should still be there.

Heh. as if it was that new :P

The processor is a DX4 100, themotherboard's there, it power's on, the light comes on, it looks like it reads C: (it might not though) then it just sits there. We aren't getting anything on the monitor, when we do it's a black screen, or 'snow', but we only got the snow once.

Sounds like the video might be bad. I assume that the video is integrated into the motherboard, and since the processor is something I've never heard of, it probably doesn't have AGP or support a PCI video card, if it even has PCI Slots, I'm gonn guess that it has ISA slots.

The only thing I can really suggest to you, is to try a different monitor. Thats as far as I can go with that. That must be a pretty old computer.

If it is using a DX4 100 you should see the bios chip ...
Take a look around, see if you can find a make and/or model number, or any other numbers on the board itself, and/or on any chips. Then google: see if you can find a manual for it.

Did you just pull this out of a closet where it was place four years ago in a working condition, or did you try to put it together without knowing jumper settings?

Does it have memory installed?

Alot more info is needed if someone is going to be able to help.

cheyenne1212 I don't recall too many of those boards having intigrated video ...

I have one that has both PCI and ISA though ( this was pre AGP )

The computer is about 4th hand now, so I'm fairly sure it's been in use most of the time since it was made.

My first thought was also video card or monitor. I've tried about 5 different monitors on it (1 of these 5 WAS toast, but the other 4 were in perfect working order). So we got a Video Card that had (supposedly) been tested, figuring the On Board Video Card had fried, it was a Trident, if that helps, and that didn't help. So now we're back to our original thought: BIOS since it isn't actually booting up.

And FYI: it has both PCI and ISA. Also a video card built into the Motherboard.

Does it use a jumper to disable the onboard video ?

Did you find any numbers on the board or chips ?

I'm not sure about jumpers, there is no plug in the Video Card that we got so I plugged it into the column of PCI(? the bigger of the two) slots. But both the on board vid and the vid card get the same result on the monitor.

The only thing that LOOKs like a BIOS reads:

CSI CAT28F010P
-15 09522E

But I could be wrong. It could be something else

Are there any Identification marks anywhere? Name, model, or fcc id number?

My first step would be to track down the bios reset jumper and short it. If that doesn't work, try to find a onboard video bypass jumper, but to be honest the mobos of that day were notorious for not having a way to bypass onboard video that worked well.

A mobo that old shouldn't have an option in the bios setup to bypass it, but even if it does you don't have a way to access it anyway.

Maybe these will help:

It says "PCB Ver 2.22" on the board itself

and two chips ON The board read:

"CIRRUS LOGIC"

and

"OPTi 82C802GA" & "OPTi 82C602A"

the OPTI chips are your chipset for the board

The CSI is an EPROM, probably containing the BIOS

how about something on the board itself ?

You have to remember, these older boards had to be configured by jumpers and switches. If you got a DIP switch or a jumper wrong the board may not work. It was important to know the proper jumper settings for them for these reasons. Also, some of those chips are older then the 486DX100, so it is possible that sometime tried to put an upgrade chip into it, it did not work, then shelved it. You will have to identify the board to ensure the jumpers are correct and the board can handle the CPU and memory.

"PCB Ver 2.22" is the only thing I see on the board, the rest are all attatched, the CSi one is the one I thought was the BIOS, but I don't see anyway to reset it. there's metal pegs around the board (and near that 'chip') that have plastic 'sheathes' over them, like a plug with the wires ripped out kind of. I was told that MAY be the 'switches' that are normally on a BIOS

those "pegs" are what some call "jumpers"

Actually, all of those metal plugs are either jumpers or they are connectors for cables. A jumper is just a way to configure something on the motherboard by shorting between two plugs with one of those plastic sheaths. However, without knowing which one to short you might damage some of the chips by indiscriminately shorting differents things. Sometimes the jumpers will be labeled in very tiny print beside them. I don't think they were labeling them as early as this mobo, but it's worth a try to get a magnifying glass and check.

Also, try to find an fcc i.d., it should be on there somewhere, although they are usually kind of hard to find. If you can find it go to

https://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/oet/c...ericSearch.cfm

You can put in the fcc id and get the manufacturer. Google the manufacturer and you may be able to find the jumper settings for that mobo or maybe even a .pdf online manual.

Thanks a lot people. Hopefully I can reset the BIOS and get things working again. Thanks for all the help.

What he described were in fact jumpers, period.

This is a security related site, and although I enjoy helping people, I am tired and can not possibly teach a 101 on what is inside when you open a computer.

Like I said, find WHATEVER you can printed on the board.

If you want to know what a jumper is, I have attached a page from an old M technologies PCI-486 ( R418 ) motherboard manual that describes a jumper.

Hope it helps you understand, and remember, google is your friend.

and, BTW, I already know that the maker of the BIOS is IBM. I know because it worked for us at some point, but then in formatting the HD it went bye-bye.

Firstly: IKnowNot a grandfather! congratulations old chap...............it is all downhill from here :D

We have an IBM of unknown origins. I have had this problem as well, and am more than willing to try to help TheSteelBlade, particularly as restoring old computers is a hobby of mine. Might I suggest that TheSteelBlade PMs me until we get it sorted out, then we can post a collective solution?

It is a 486 DX4/100. This means that it will only be about 8 years old. This is a 486 processor with a math co-processor, running at 100Mhz. "The last of the 486's" In their day they could give a PI/75Mhz a run for it's money. I would guess that the FSB is 66Mhz, but it could be 75?

I have not been there recently, but the IBM technical support site used to be one of the best, particularly with support for obsolete products.

If TheSteelBlade will contact me, I will do my level best.

BTW don't e-mail, I have just gone to broadband so I do not check my POP3 that regularly, I will alter the contact details when I have finalised a webmail provider.

Good Luck

Aside from the number/letter codes labelling all the pieces of the board I can find:

2 'bar code' stickers "J105W..." & "J10EE..."

26859 (stamped in white)

PCB Ver 2.22

Type C-2

on the back:
65G4187
EC D26208H

That's all I can find, I can see the Jumpers, and I know it was an IBM BIOS, if that helps any. I'm just not sure how to reset the BIOS with the jumpers.

Whilst it could be a BIOS problem I would have thought this unlikely?

Can you get hold of a floppy boot disk and see if it will boot into DOS. I would try this with the hard drive connected and disconnected if that doesn't work.

You mentioned that you had reformatted the hard drive? so that might be where the problem is? I would try putting the hard drive into another machine, and see if it boots.

It might also be worthwhile trying a different video cable.

When you try to bood do you get lights and noise from the hard drive..........if so, how long for?

Cheers

Quote:

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Originally posted here by IKnowNot
This is a security related site, and although I enjoy helping people, I am tired and can not possibly teach a 101 on what is inside when you open a computer.

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Hehe, I was wondering when the patience would run out.

Well done for hanging in that long.

Steve

I have tried boot disks but the BIOS is needed to tell the computer to read the Floppy Drive, plus I know what the BIOS looks like on the screen when the computer boots up. If I could get it to DOS then I'd at least know it'w working and I could reinstall Windows and I'd be set, but I can't even do that.

Where I am coming from is that your boot sequence may point to the C:\ drive. If there is a problem with this, then that is as far as you will get.

If the jumpers have not been moved, then they are probably not the problem? The most usual thing to alter with jumpers is the BIOS security password..............

If you disconnect the C:\ drive, it just might try to boot from A:\?

I would still recommend that you test the C:\ drive, and even load the OS onto it on another machine. It is beginning to sound as if you might have a problem with other elements like the RAM or processor?

If the BIOS chip itself is the problem, all you can do is bin the lot...............not worth repairing, even if you could.

Cheers

Just my 2 cents -- 'Snow' is typically a result of a faulty processor. You will generally get absolutely nothing but the sound from the power supply on startup, if the BIOS is bad. I would put my money on a processor issue from the sound of things.

If the computer turns on and a bios screen doesn't come on then you usually have three problems:
A:) Your video card isn't inserted right, cables arn't connected, or video card is bad.
B.) Your processor has gone to a better place
C.) It hates you

Just to check though, are there any beep codes? A Video error is usually one long beep, followed by either two or three short beeps. If there are any other beep codes place them here. And by the way, the bios is on the motherboard firmware, formatting the harddrive woudn't affect it at all. And if you can't get past the bios, don't worry about using boot disks to try and get to DOS, you won't get there.

that's cute my bullet turned into a smiley D;