Memory Fragmentation

Good Day Folks,

Seems I have been suffering from more that normal computer freeze-ups, 3 within a half hour. At first I thought it was a software issue with an OS, and since I dual boot two hdds, I just switched to Slack on the same hdd and shortly thereafter the computer froze up again.

Soft rebooted into setup and checked temps: CPU was 49C and System was 48C, all fans working fine with good air flow so heat doesn't appear to be an issue. Checked all voltages against the standards and they are all fine and dandy within a few hundredths. Memory display is normal. So I booted into SuSE 9.0 on hdd2 and googled for computer freezes (non-software type) and searched our forums.

And "Memory Fragmentation" was listed as a cause. Cure listed was to shut the computer all the way down, unplug it and then wait for awhile, plug it back in, then reboot. Rebooted back into the 1st hd and now it seems to be working fine. Didn't tell me much except now it appears to work.

The things I was doing at the time: Windows - Slim Browser on AO and Ice Chat on IRC for the first time. The second time on Linux - Xchat on IRC and Galeon on AO.

Guess the question is, has any one else experienced this and please elaborate on what it is. Also is it a symptom of memory going out?

Thanks much.

What are your hardware specifications?

Basically the problems are that programs run and do not release RAM when they close.

Systems resources are another issue.

You might try running a RAM defragmenter?

Cheers

On the Window's machine, run Disk Defragmenter, Disk Cleanup, and DriveSpace. That might help out with the freezing issue's. Try to get rid of whatever application's/services/etc you don't need or use.

Good Day Spider32 & Nihil,

Problem went away after a complete shutdown, including removing the plug from the AC.

AuthenticAMD AMD Athlon(tm) XP processor 1900+
K7SEM Main Board
2 Box Fans & one CPU Fan, temps always around 48C
73% system resources free
21in X-Flat
350W PWR SUP

First HDD
C: Win98se 40gb
D: (Storage) 30gb
E: (Storage) 25gb
F: Slack 25gb

Second HDD:
XP: 30gb
SuSE 10gb

Memory: 512
56X CD Player
CDRW
2 Nics > Switch > old 500 box with Smoothwall

No Special Graphics or Sound Card (not a gamer so never got one)

Startup only includes the bare minimum and a firewall.

Was having this problem only occasionally before, so I did a complete cleanup included re-partitioning & format & fresh install of less software. Defragged after all software was installed. Run a batch every so often to get rid of stuff in the index.dat (as per my post on the interesting file thread :D ) I cleanup all the usual stuff everyother day (spybot, adaware, TDS-3, temps etc)

Well, shoot fire, I might as well give you address tooooo...lol

So I’ll start google for a ram defrag tool. Thanks mucho

Additionally, could a mouse-going-bad, cause the freezes. On all occasions, the mouse was in motion (pointer moving) when the computer froze up. And, it happened on completely different OS's. Windows first, then Slack, then windows again.

cheers

Hi Relyt,

If it happens again, see if the numlock and capslock keys work (turn the keyboard lights on/off) that should tell you if you have properly frozen, or if it is just the mouse.

I use Ram Idle Pro and RamBooster as defragmentation/monitoring tools. (On different machines of course)

You did not say how much RAM you actually have.

Also worth a thought, what firewall and AV products are you running?

Cheers

EDIT: Another thing to check is that you have uninstalled any time expired trial software. I have seen freezes that appear to be caused by it trying to send you a nag screen, and getting into a "deadly embrace" with something else. But, as it seems to happen with more than one OS this is probably not your problem.

Are your two HDDs close together? I would look at installing a fan to cool them, your temperatures seem on the high side to me. I would run a surface scan to see if there are any errors detected. I have two 1900+ boxes and they are both running around 37-39C

Nihil,

RAM is 512

The NumLock lights go out and all other keyboard functions went south.

ZA & AVG (used this combo for eons)

Completed a complete scan of both hdd and no errors detected.

Both Hdds are space about 4 inches apart in the tower with room. But hey, I can always put more fans in and see if that will lower the temps another 10C. I'll pull the cover off for awhile and see if that help as well.

The only software that is trial is TDS-3 and MIRC and both have not expired yet and when the nag screen comes up I'll buy them.

edit: It has happened on both Windows and Linux and only when I was moving the mouse. Which obviously doesnt mean the mouse caused it, but rather that a resource was being used.

Thanks

I used to have cooling/heating issue's as well, and I think you might have something similiar. Keep your room tempature slightly cooler than regular and maybe buy/add another fan for the tower. By making sure that's not an issue, you've just made freezing less likely to happen 35%.

Hi Relyt,

Well as far as I can see:

512Mb RAM should be OK. I don't think there is a problem with this, as defective RAM usually gives you boot-up problems, rather than freezes.

I don't know if your MoBo BIOS or other software supports it, but if you have the fan speed linked to temperature, turn it to full blast.

I have been running an XP1900 with WinXP Pro for a few hours now. I have a CPU temp of 40-41C and a system temp of 26C. Room temperature is 21.4 at the ceiling and 19.8 at the floor (laser-guided spot temperature meter) :cool:

So I guess you are a bit on the high side, but that could be your room temperature.........when you use air cooling, as we mostly do, your system temp will be relative to the ambient (air) temp.

Some further thoughts:

1. In BIOS, disable all power saving options, set it to on, all the time
2. Whilst you are there disable "hibernate"
3. In your display control, set screensaver to "none" (if you can, otherwise use the Windows default. Also disable the power saving options there as well.
4. Check that you are NOT overclocking your CPU and/or videocard.
5. Be careful of scheduled and "background" tasks, you don't want anything starting on its own.
6. Turn off ZA and AVG autoupdate/reminders (As a combo I have run them for a long time without problems just like you)
:)
7. Try another mouse

Look for an "exhaust fan", these take up one of the expansion slots and lie flat, they get rid of 40-60 cfm of air out of your case. Cost around $5-10.

Please let us know how you get on.

Good Day Nihil,

Well I read some of your previous posts about overheating and already completed most of your list. :D So kudos for that.

Since it froze on both windows and linux, we're definitely looking at a non-software issue. I've popped another mouse on that I know is good and I've got another fan I can install as well to get the temps down more. I'm going to reduce the load on the power supply by disconnecting the second hard disk and the second CD Player, just to see if the voltages changes at all. Could be a power supply issue. Just trying to narrow it down some more obviously. (Obviously I'll make the changes one at a time....lol)

:)

Edit: Thanks Sypder and I have it in an air conditioned room with a good ceiling fan right over head, but like you said it could be a over-heating issue. So I'll put that additional fan on. Gunna be like a hurricane in there though... :eek:

Thanks for your continued assistance.

HOwdy,

Well, I stripped it down to only one hdd, added a additional fan(now there's a cpu fan, a supply fan, and an exhaust fan, a new mouse, checked every piece of software that could be running in the background (but that only explains windows freeze, however not the linux freeze that it does also).

The main board and cpu are only about 2 years old, not overclocked or abused other than normal wear and tear. About every 2 weeks, I open it up and blow all the dust, if any is present, clean the fan blades with a soft brush and check all the connections.

I'll look once more inside the setup and see if there is anything else, but not having any luck with resolving this issue. I though I had it licked but it just did it again about 20 minutes ago.

We'll see.

cheers

Hi Relyt,

What are your system and CPU temperatures now?

Do you notice your room lights flickering, going dim? having any problems with your TV? It is posssible that your power supply company is having problems. A surge protector does not protect you against "brown outs" which is when the current drops.

You might like to download a memory checker and see if the RAM is OK, also get the diagnostics tools for your HDD and run those. As I said, I would expect boot problems or crashes, rather than freeze ups, but you might as well eliminate the possibilities if you can.

Good luck

Hey Nihil,

I did some more tinkering around. I had a somewhat larger box fan with longer and larger blades, so only had to drill a couple of holes and used some of the existing one, and now the air is even flowing more.

The CPU temp has dropped from 49 to 46C and the Main Board temp dropped from 48 to 44C.
So that is pretty significant! The larger fan draws less voltage as well, but produces more rpms. :) But my wife's temps are 37C :rolleyes:

When I built the computer I can't remember if I used the silver paste or the white junk. So I'll get some of that in a couple of weeks. There are no good computer shops around here and it's about a 3-4 hour drive to any major city. Might just order it online, might get it quicker!

We do have an occasional flickering of the lights. I have a real expensive surge suppressor because of the Thunderstorms we get here, however currently I do not have a voltage filtering UPS. Guess that might be a procurement as well.

I'll hunt down a memory check online, tomorrow morning and see.

Thanks again for you help!

:)

For a good/recommended RAM testing program, get Memtest86 ( http://www.memtest86.com/ )

Find the ISO image, burn it to a CD, and boot up. Make sure to boot from CD in BIOS. A very easy way to test RAM that is OS independant and quite safe. Run through a few different tests/patterns. You don't need to do every single test (might take many hours), but after three or four different patterns through your RAM you should know if you RAM is defective or not.

Thanks Tim_axe,

Downloaded it and will burn in on a cd today. Hours to conduct the testing! Oh well if I must...lol

cheers

Thanks to everyone for helping me out. Here's the link to the solutions of my system freezes:

http://www.antionline.com/showthread...hreadid=258418


:cool:

Relyt.......

You should be the dog in Moxnix's avatar

:D

No Doubt Nihil,

I deserve it.... :D

Well at least I found the problem. Everything was crying for juice and the fan was robbing it from them. Even all the software is extremely fast once more....lol

thanks.

Fair play to you mate!.......you beat me..........I would never have spotted that without popping the case :)

And your specs looked pretty good as well...........I have loads of boxes out there with a 350W supply. 2HDDs, 3.5", modem, DVD, CD R/W/RW, AGP, NIC, 2 case fans, exhaust fan, power supply fan............and they work just fine :confused:

Anyways, glad to hear you have it sorted.................and you can teach an old dog new tricks..........but not Mox's way? :D

Hi Nihil,

I think Mox is just having to much fun with his avatar. That's probably really him. :D

Well hopefully folks trying to troubleshoot problems will read the thread thoroughly and learn from it. There's was a ton of great information passed back forth that will help them keep their computer running properly and help them stay away from Mox's spankings. :eek:

:)