Paying with credit card

I recently dined at a restaurant on John Street in Toronto. I do have a habit to pay with my credit card. I usually get up from the table to pay the bill instead of giving the credit card to the waiter. So this time I did the same.

I have to say I was surprised as I looked at them swipe my card on a PC that was sitting there and than swipe it again at the bank terminal device beside it. They did not think anything of it and when I asked them why they are swiping it twice, they said it is their regular process. I asked for a manager and he had the same explanation. He also gave me the head office contact I can call which I did. After 30 minutes of explaining what my concern is and him trying to tell me that every merchant is doing the same thing, I told him I am going to call Visa to see what their policy with regards to this is. He than told me that the reason for it is that their PC software is not up to date and that they can not update it now ($$$). My last question to him was if I go there next time and refuse to have my card scanned twice, will I still be able to pay with it? The answer was no.

So, what do you guys and girls thing, is this me or is something fishy going on here?

if there PC software is out of date then they shouldnt be using it...out of date means vulnerability. Id call visa and repor them. There is NO need to scan it twice. if its in the credit card machine then its done, no pc needed. my best guess is that they keep track of the sales on the PC and swipe the card to show how the customer paid the bill. I would rather go get cash...

Call the card supplier [?]
Give them your worries, and reasons for them.

Give details of the premises doing this.

Leave it to them to sort out.

Find another restaurant ...............

Have you tried using your card elsewhere ?
Does ANYONE else do this ?

There is no reason in this world why the restaurant should scan your card twice. Even the earliest based softwares only require *one* scan of the card, or manual entry, on *one* device.

I'm quite sure I would never again give this restaurant my patronage unless I was paying cash, and that I would call VISA and let them know what's up - giving the restaurant name, address, phone number, date and time of my visit, and who I'd spoken to there. This may well be (yet another) attempt at 'customer tracking' - kind of like Radio Shack did awhile back when they required your name, address, and phone number even on cash-only purchases. I stopped shopping with them when they tried this the first time on me, and refuse them my business still today (although I've been told they've stopped again).

I'd file a complaint with the BBB - in this case, Canada's equal: http://www.canadiancouncilbbb.ca and I would never pay with a credit card there again.

I complement you on being an aware customer. Many persons would just take it and say nothing. Questioning like this may shake loose a slip up by a restaurant skimmer.

I suspect that in this situation, there is probably no cause for alarm, the restaurant point of sale system is not linked or "updated" or they changed merchant banks and that is the reason they are not linked together. It probably cost money to get them to work together.

It is more common to have your credit card "skimmed" in a restaurant by a device such as this

http://www.tyner.com/magnetic/msr500m.htm

The merchants of such devices imply that there are legitimate uses for these things, but I have not seen such and I routinely examine them containing customer's credit card numbers.

Also the trend in the UK and Europe and I hear Mexico is this type of parasitic device on an ATM

http://www.utexas.edu/admin/utpd/atm.html

Lastly, I have seen what I call a PS2 connector style hardware Key logger installed on some Point of Sale machines. Basically, they install them inline when no one is looking and come back to recover their loot(credit card numbers) at a later time.

I suspect we will see either
A change in the way credit cards are processed (i.e. moving away from the mag stripe)
Or like Mexico does today, they bring the portable point of sale machine to your table and you swipe your credit card. This was done due to the problem of skimming in that country.
RP

Simply playing the Devil's Advocate, may I suggest that the manager is not lying to you?

Say the system is out of date. They run the Credit Card through the reader that dials up to Credit Card Company for authorization. It connects, you're authorized, and the receipt prints out. That's the end of it.

So now, what record do they have (for book-keeping purposes)that says how you paid?


Instead of Running it through for authorization, then taking an imprint of your card, they're simply running it through twice. So rather than a hard-copy paper-trail, they only have a digital one.

Something similar happened to me last year I want to share, when I was at Toronto at a store(forgot the name). The guy at the counter swiped my CC three time... yeah three times. I asked him why three times he gently replied that my card wasn't accepted for the two times and added, it may be due to wearing out of card(he was right. It was much used). I believed his story and came back home and there was nothing wrong with the bill, when checked later.

Quote:

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Originally posted here by :Singh:
The guy at the counter swiped my CC three time... yeah three times. I asked him why three times he gently replied that my card wasn't accepted for the two times and added, it may be due to wearing out of card(he was right. It was much used)

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That happens so often it isn't even funny.

From working in retail, and my own experience, I can tell you it can be a pain in the ass when you're using an over-used card. I've found that Debit Cards from local banks tend to be the worst when it comes to magnetic-stripe longevity.

I have noticed at the Southwest Airline terminals to board their planes faster if all you have is carry-on luggage, passegers can use "any" plastic credit card with a magnetic strip, this simple scans for the passengers address and name.PERIOD After that in then matches the persons info and prints out their boarding pass, Away they go, i have done this several times with out any concerns after talking to one of their employess.

I suspect the business is scanning for your personal info and then swiping it again on the pay terminal to get their $$$, Then they have a handy profile on everyone,and even what they ate! Kinda like "cookies" are on the internet.

This is just a comment , I would ask them what information each swipe gathers and demand to watch the screen as they do it, of course some folks get a little uneasy when your staring over their shoulder,next time pay ca$h.

I have noticed at the Southwest Airline terminals to board their planes faster if all you have is carry-on luggage, passegers can use "any" plastic credit card with a magnetic strip, this simple scans for the passengers address and name.PERIOD After that in then matches the persons info and prints out their boarding pass, Away they go, i have done this several times with out any concerns after talking to one of their employess.

I suspect the business is scanning for your personal info and then swiping it again on the pay terminal to get their $$$, Then they have a handy profile on everyone,and even what they ate! Kinda like "cookies" are on the internet.

This is just a comment , I would ask them what information each swipe gathers and demand to watch the screen as they do it, of course some folks get a little uneasy when your staring over their shoulder,next time pay ca$h.

I'm quite sure we'd all have a "Charmin Moment" if we actually knew how many computers have our personal information, or are collecting it!

Our local super market has a membership card that is swiped along with our debit card, every time we shop there. The encouragement to use it comes from the large discounts they provide. However they are recording everything I buy. Thus the profiles are being created for later use. Ace Hardware Stores are also doing the same thing.

Sooner or later, it will probably all be compiled into a data base on the Gibson.

cheers

What I would suggest for the future is contact your bank and ask them if you can link your account activity to your cellphone...that way you would immediately see if it was swapped twice because the amount would then be subtracted twice from your account and you would get 2 sms ,s to your cellphone confirming that...We in SA can do that so I am sure it is possible in your country..In general I think it is a good idea because any activity on your account gets sent to your mobile..be it deposit, debit orders etc..

You have instant prove and can confront these people there on the spot

cheers
vanman