***confusion/doubts about hacking***

I dont care if i get flamed ( as i have been in some other websites) and till no i have not got a satisfactory answer to this question.As this question is very relative, googling it dosnet make sence as it can be answered by only knowledge and experience.
I taught myself html java scripting php and linux(i am still in nwbie level) and C. when i started challanges on hackthissite and try2hack noticed that i needed knowledge of shtml mysql applet programmming vb cgi pearl and many other stuff.This is gettng way out of hand as i am confused as what to learn and leave.
There seems to be so much to learn so i what should i do ,on what should a begginer like me concrate on.
AS you can see i am particularly intrested in web based i also want to learn socket programming , although in collage they are going to teach me c from the second semester i would like to know the real applications of c programming , not to learn mathmatics using c.
How do i suppose i do that (the real applications of c programming), would you suggest i read codes from open source porjects or do you people have any other suggestions.
AS web and operating systems are closely realted i want to know how t understand windows( as i can get information on understanding linux a lot easier by googling on the subject)
i know i need to learn about registery and stuff but is batch file programming necessary in GUI environment . are there any other special programming launguages i need to know to understand windows, if so then pleae name it along with its level (newbie middle expert) newbie meaning i need not know anyother programming language to learn that launguage.
for example cgi may be treated as middle level because it requires knowledge of pearl
How important is assembly launguage in todays computing environment.
Thanks in advance and wishing you all a belated happy new year 2006 orion9

Well, there are people here way more qualified to answer most of your questions.

My advice is to be careful of using the word "hacking" as its meaning has changed, and means different things to different people. An old fart such as myself would take it to mean possessing considerable skills and knowledge together with the ability to produce innovative workarounds.

I believe that what you are describing is more correctly known as "wargaming"?

As a general thought, I still believe that batch file processing still has a place, and is worth learning.

:)

When I was asking for a drink of water I was provided a fully charged firehose to sip from. Just as I couldn't consume all the water rapidly flowing out of the firehose, you cannot learn everything in a short period of time. Hell not even in a few years! Sounds like you are trying to learn too much too quick(placing unrealistic goals upon yourself) and you will only become mediocre at all of them. First, I would follow the learning sequence that is provided in college. If you want to add to it, try to decide what you what to be doing in the next few years. pick one language that corresponds to that, master it and then move on with another to help you accomplish the original goal. You will see a ton similairities between all of them and it does get easier as you go along.

Now the math part of the scenario. Everything revolves around math. Whether we are talking about the Internet connnection you are using to come to AO or the Earth in it's orbit. Everything is dependent upon math, even populating the earth. Don't we subtract clothes, add ourselves, and multiply?

Anyway, just as learning a language is progressive, math is the same and very much a part of it. We learn concept upon concept. No math = no programming.

cheers

Relyt is spot on as usual. You do need the math, but you can insofar as your courses allow, be a bit selective.

For example I have found algebra (particularly matrix algebra) and statistics to be very useful

I would guess that if you were into design then geometry would come in handy? (it certainly helps when you are laying new floor tiles in the john ;) )

:)

Relyt's right,you do seem to be in a rather big hurry to become ub3r l33t..relax,take a deep breath and all that;)
As already suggested,orient yourself towards what you want to do.Computers're a very vast field and the best(read as least time consuming) to gain knowledge is to try and become a master of one trade rather than try to juggle bits and pieces all around.You want to code,fine,decide which language,and read as much as you can upon it.(practice,obviously,being the other important aspect;))..you want to learn about an OS,fine,there're a million sites on the web and a LOT of good books that you can refer to.It's admirable that you've started teaching yourself,it's the best way to learn in my opinion.Assembly language,hmm,not very unless you plan to go into that line of work.
Feel free to post or pm me if you have any doubts.

Cheers

Quote:

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Originally posted here by orion9

AS you can see i am particularly intrested in web based i also want to learn socket programming , although in collage they are going to teach me c from the second semester i would like to know the real applications of c programming , not to learn mathmatics using c.
How do i suppose i do that (the real applications of c programming), would you suggest i read codes from open source porjects or do you people have any other suggestions.
AS web and operating systems are closely realted i want to know how t understand windows( as i can get information on understanding linux a lot easier by googling on the subject)
i know i need to learn about registery and stuff but is batch file programming necessary in GUI environment . are there any other special programming launguages i need to know to understand windows, if so then pleae name it along with its level (newbie middle expert) newbie meaning i need not know anyother programming language to learn that launguage.
for example cgi may be treated as middle level because it requires knowledge of pearl
How important is assembly launguage in todays computing environment.
Thanks in advance and wishing you all a belated happy new year 2006 orion9

---

I think one mistake you are making is in telling yourself that learning how to do complicated mathmatics in C is not useful. I would venture to say that every really good programmer has to understand how to do complicated problems in C, which is almost always gained by doing mathmatical exercises. Understanding data structures, and how to quickly and efficiently manipulate data structures is key to being a good programmer. It just teaches great logic skills. If you don't understand complex logic problems, you might as well give it up on being a very well versed programmer.

I say that batch programming is necessary in a GUI environment. I'm a systems engineer/administrator managing a large number of machines. I use batch programming almost daily to get things done across a large number of machines in short order. However, a really good friend of mine is a .Net developer and I would venture to guess that he probably never uses batch programming.

The other people who have replied are accurate in that it sounds like you are trying to learn to much to quick. You need to find one thing that you like, and stick with it. If you want to do OS level programming in C, learn to do that and don't sweat the other stuff. It will take you quit a while to really master using C. And you will find that you can do everything you want in C. I use batch programming because it is easy and fast, and no need for a compiler. A person that is very well versed in C would use C because that is what they are comfortable with. Always remember that for any task you need to get done, you can probably come up with hundreds, if not thousands of different ways of doing it.

First and foremost, I beleave that the biggest problem here is that these kids are the first to make attempts at living up to other's expectations. If he does take it easy then there is a large chance this won't do much for his particular "problem". Lets say, ten years down the line he's almost seen and done it all but has never reached a point where he can feel both smart and hip calling himself a l33t h4x0r d00d.

I think everyone should ******** things...

You can be one of these kids who go around calling themselves or others hackers. Or you can do what actually interests you with computers and just leave it at that. You'll have a much better chance of making others think your smart and cool through the latter anyway, IMHO.

Quote:

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Originally posted here by Penelope Mills
First and foremost, I beleave that the biggest problem here is that these kids...

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Penelope Mills' birthday: 1987-10-14

His birthday: 1987-12-09


:D :D :D

Yeah, I assume that all h4x0rs are younger than I am. When one turns out to be older then it adds to the humor.

Two rules.

[list=1][*]Computers are fun.[*]Don't neglect your love life.[/list=1]

I am reminded of that great hacking movie "War Games". There was this kid
who wasn't really brilliant. He just knew a few tricks that made him smarter
than the average computer user. He used these skills to accomplish two
things.

[list=1][*]Almost start a nuclear war.[*]Impress his girl friend.[/list=1]

Have fun and don't neglect your love life.
:cool:

in the end it all comes up to what he wants to do.

get into websites, get passwords.
defacing websites.
penetration testing.
crack full version programs and use them for free.
get into networks, compromise security and stuff like that.

you know most of them are illegal


orion9 is already doing college. he not only has the study material but also the teachers from whom he can learn.
from his question here, what he wants is stuff like "website? members? passwords?........no porbs....use this tool(very helpful)"

one has to learn slowly, understand what is going on in own computer to understand how to get into others. how to secure own website to understand how to get into another.

orion9, before anyone can give you suggestions on what you should learn, we need to know your goals. if you just want to "hack" (i personally like the older definitions better) websites and beat the challenge then it can be relatively simple. because you are in college and learning C im assuming u are a little more serious about it than that and actually want to make a career out of it.

find out what you love about computers and what you want to do. then find out how to go about getting there.

i can definately sympathize with wanting to learn as much as i can about computers as humanly possible. im a sophomore in high school and am teaching myself 2 languages (perl, C++) and learning a 3rd at school (python). im setting up a linux cluster (with possibly a DOS/Unix dual boot mixed in) in my basement out of recycled computers from friends. Im already planning my senior project (an IDS cluster in the schools network) while most comp. sci. students dont really care. as you can tell im a bit of an over achiever so i have to say thanks to all those guys who just posted about slowing down and making sure you can do what you love to well and then moving on to other things to enhance that.

hope you are succesful in your studies
-Godsrock37

rcgreen,

After a while it becomes:

1) Your love life is fun
2) Don't neglect computers

:)

Cheers

These "Hacker" Posts crack me up. I AM A HACKER! Not because I want to deface web sites or steal someone's Credit Card Number, but because when I first started working with computers...... Pay Attention.......


THERE WERE NO MANUALS

No College courses, no certification paths, no World Wide Web and least of all no Google. You could not get a Masters in Computer Science. Back then it was called Engineering.

So to my point. If you want to know how computers work, you want to be a Hacker, and you don't know where to start. Start with yourself. What do you want to do? What do you want your computer to do?

Answer these questions and then decide if you want to use other peoples knowledge or gain the knowledge on your own.

You have the advantage I did not. Some one has already written it down for you. The steps are documented. And the best thing is you don't have to know all the logic gates on an Intel Processor (Assembly)

God forbid you would have to would have to define your arrays as

mov al, [B + 3]
mov al, [B + 4]
mov al, [A + 10]
mov al, [A + 15]
mov al, [B - 3]
mov al, [C - 10]

Anyway, Relax and decide what you want to do. Jack of all trades does not come from School (In this field anyway). Learn what you want to do and learn it well. Everything else will come with experience. And remember rule #1 What goes around comes around. You use your skills for bad and it will BYTE you in the ass at some point in time.

Peace

Dino

just a side note: Learn how things work. Try to understand why you want something to move from a to d without using c. Once you understand the why's and what's; the how's will become simple.

PM me if you want more clarification.

Your missing your base/index actually.

So, dino, what's wrong with assembly? Everyone should learn assembly!

;)

Quote:

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Originally posted here by rapier57
So, dino, what's wrong with assembly? Everyone should learn assembly!

;)

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LOL I learned assembly on a 8080 processor. That was easy. I wouldn't even attempt writing something in assembly on todays processors. Not with debug anyway.

So much to learn, so little time. *sigh*

Its a delimma im sure most of us face. Its not unusual if u think theres too much stuff to learn out there and u are having a hard time catching up. To be honest, we all are in same boots.

Technology changes rapidly and even the experts themselves try to catch up by taking courses every now and then. Just take it easy. Best way to know what to learn first is set urself a goal and plot ur way through.

U got ur targets set, u wanted to do web based stuff. Segment it down to web dev and networking.

I took courses myself, and to be honest, half of them are already obselete. I also read stuff constantly. Security news, tutorials, pdf documents i downloaded over p2p. If u want to focus on a specific subject, theres boundless information out there.

I remember it took me months of reading pdf files, visiting sites and reading tutorials to get a good grasp of how VPN actually works. Great help i had with VPN was when i got my current job and one of the IT Support guys actually explain to me how our VPN works. Practical learning is a lot more informative than theory. So id suggest u also hang around with the right crowd.

Just take it easy buddy, it will all come to u in time. dont force urself to learn too much in a short period of time. If theres anything "hacking" has ever taught me, its patience. Gotta have it, if u wanna make it.

Hi, until you realise that hacking is a long and dreary process of trial and error and not a spoon fed meal that mommy and daddy are going to give you over a week, I'll leave you with this quote from the book "Fight Club".

May I never be complete. May I never be content. May I never be perfect.

Think about it.

First i want to clarify these points
*** whenb i said i want to learn about web programming i ment tcp/ip vpn and other stuuf in that feild I DONT PLAN TO HACK INTO WEBSITES ,CRACK SOFTWARE OR PASSWORDS OR GOING TO JAIL.
************* I HAVE A SPECIAL THING FOR WEB PROGRAMMING BECAUSE H.T.M.L IS THE FIRST THING I LEARN ABOUT AS A """PROGRAMMING''" LAUNGUAGE(in essence GET AN OUTPUT THAT I WANTED)
*****I brough in that maths comment beause in our collage right now they are just teaching to find lets seee........to convert degrees into radians searching out strings in a given array NOT TO FIND THE LENGHT OF AN TANGENT TO A PARABOLA when a third order exact lenear diffrential equation is given
******IN OUR UNIVERSITY WE CALL IT Bachelors of/in Engineering (computer science)

Sure read as much code as you can find, tinker with it, learn to identify the good from the bad and learn to write good code. Learning how to do anything (even math) well gives you a good building block to write more advanced code.

As to getting to grips with Windows, yes batch programming can still be of use, I`m also rather partial to assembler. (which always has a place).. get to grips with the regsitry, lots of stuff goes on in there, understand how Windows authentication works. See how apps works, when you open up a program what happens? Ideally you could use IDAPro/rational purify etc... to run apps through, but you don`t have that so go look for something else, there is much out there.

Read a good book on networking. Then run a packet sniffer (TCPDump, ethereal, etc..) and see what you can see, in fact boot up windows and then run a sniffer and see all the crap that comes off a box, what does it all do?

Set up a test environment, mess around with it, break it, rebuild, repeat..

Learn Ruby as it rocks