How do you feel about being monitored on line?

[Alcatraz]

Wow. This is the most intelligent post I've seen in a while. Privacy online really brings it out in us. And it bothers me too, but I have mixed emotions...

Sure I want the terrorists and criminals caught. But I don't want my e-mail read. But if the government wanted to read my e-mail they could do that. They don't need permission. Privacy has never been an issue. If they want it they can get it. They problem is the negative publicity. They get all sorts of **** for going after a criminal and accidentally stumbling into an innocent's privacy. Getting permission to do this won't change anything. I'll still be mad if they blatantly invade my privacy whether or not its a damn law. They make the laws but they don't hafta follow them.

For all I know, they could be reading my mail right now.

[Anirak]

Originally posted by S_Tsirtonis
This may seem like stupid question to as in a forum such as this where civil liberties are high on the agenda. I also know that in the US you are far more vocal on the subject than people in the UK.

In an ideal world I would prefer that people did not monitor my traffic. Unfortunately we do not live in an ideal world and people do evil things like fly into the side of buildings and kill thousands of people, molest children etc.

Crime is getting ever more sophisticated and I am aware that encryption is readily available and things can be hidden within jpg images etc. Nevertheless, I feel in order to stand a chance of controlling these hideous crimes some sort of monitoring facility has to be available.

Is it to much to ask for an impairment on your civil liberties in order to even slightly reduce suffering. If even if it stops the abuse of one little girl doesn’t that justify the entire project.

If the answer is no then you are a very selfish person. If you are that person who gets in the way because of a selfish obsession with privacy then I hope you can do it with a clear conscious.

This does not mean that I approve of a floodgate approach. I mean proper regulated monitoring where a regulatory body can go back and check what the agencies have been doing.

Are you saying we should be MONITORED on the internet. If you are then that is the gayest **** I have ever heard. If some stupid person is on the internet givin away their information, then that is their fault, not mine, and I sure as hell shouldn't be punished for it...

[j0bber]

Alright, I'm not going to offer my opinion on this matter, because to be honest, it would sound repetitive. Basically it would be a combo of just about everyone elses replies/posts.

But one thing I must comment on is the feelings portrayed by "jiffy." It's the attitude of "I don't care what happens so you shouldn't care what the govt. does either."

"Ignorance is bliss," someone once said, and I think he was right. A lot of people in this world, know exactly what's going on with the privacy issue, but they choose to turn a deaf ear to it all. The other half know what's going on, and will fight it all the way to the ground. I think we should never get to the point of "turning a deaf ear to it all."

We vote these guys into the governement. (at least some) We made a conscious decision to give these guys power over certain issues. It just seems like a waste to pretend like nothing is happening...and to let whatever they do, go un-protested.
I must say, though, this has been one of my favorite threads ever started. Threads like these really weed out the people on this site who joined just to learn how to "h4cK h0tmaiL."

Thank you S_Tsirtonis for giving birth to the intelligent posters out there. What next?

[Anirak]

Originally posted by j0bber
Alright, I'm not going to offer my opinion on this matter,

Isn't that what you just did?

[j0bber]

Yeah, I apologize for that contradiction.

My initial "post attitude" was that of a very general, no opinion post, but then that part of me was over-taken by my opinionated side.

I'm sorry. What can I say?
"The Spirit is willing, but the body is weak."

[Anirak]

I still do not agree with the stupid No Privacy ****

[TeKRoMaNCeR]

On a serious note.. The monitoring of internet activity is simply a daft idea.. First off, sure.. the filters would narrow down the input of 'criminal activity' to a slim couple of billion users, but how would you defrentiate someone who is looking for the solvent of the crime or one who is the bane of all good and right..? Let's say a detective was investigating a crime, or a teen was doing a report on anti-forensic precautions used in crime.. Are the Feds gonna bust down the door and take this kid in for questioning? Also, what about forced links.. In my days of ignorance, when I would look for porn.. (Hey, what can I say, I love hentai..) I would get stuck with 30 windows popping up.. I'm sure most of you can relate.. perhaps in pirated download sites.. unfortunately, when you click on the link promising the free download to the latest game on the market, there is no way to fend off the dozens of assorted advertisements for sites that come up on your computer.. okay.. where am I going with this? Criminals are sly.. they have a way to get around anything, especially internet monitoring.. just like another user posted about the mobile phone example.. My.. now I see why all of these posts are so long.. so much to say.. Also, America inparticularly wants to monitor EVERYTHING.. yes.. I'm American.. but.. let's say the criminal activity is coming from Cuba, under what jurisdiction does the USA have to hunt down the criminals there? I read a while back about a hacker from some miniscule country who unleashed a very destructive virus.. America immediately hunted for this hacker and.. to my surprise went to this country and detained him.. I was astonished that they were as bold to intrude upon another countries jurisdiction.. well.. maybe not so astonished.. we've been doing this forever.. But who should have the final say..? Grrr.. *Fights urge to rant on* End post!!

=]:

[stflook]

I know that things are different in the UK, so I'm merely going to state my opinion instead of flaming the hell out of you like I want to.

It is always too much to ask to give up civil liberties for a little temporary security. That is one of the biggest ideals upon which this country was founded. I would much rather die free than live without privacy. The government has the power to make the country a very safe place to be, but people would rather have their lives. There are criminals that get away with crimes because the fourth amendment to our constitution protects us from unreasonable searches and seizures. People would not stand for that kind of that invasion of privacy, where a cop can pull you over at random and search your person and property at his/her own will. The same thing applies on the internet. Where I go and what I do on the internet is MY business; nobody else's. If the government was looking over everybody's shoulder all the time to make sure they're acting legally, we would all be spending more time in jail than out of it. The court system would be flooded with petty cases, and our judicial system would be slowed to a crawl.

Believing that civil liberties are a top priority does not make me a selfish person, and I'm frankly very offended that you would say something like that. What's so selfish about wanting freedom from an oppressive government? Absolutely nothing. Governments like this have been tried, and almost all of them have failed miserably. There is a reason for that.

[darkes]

In reply to Alcatraz
==============================================
Wow. This is the most intelligent post I've seen in a while. Privacy online really brings it out in us. And it bothers me too, but I have mixed emotions...

Sure I want the terrorists and criminals caught. But I don't want my e-mail read. But if the government wanted to read my e-mail they could do that. They don't need permission. Privacy has never been an issue. If they want it they can get it. They problem is the negative publicity. They get all sorts of **** for going after a criminal and accidentally stumbling into an innocent's privacy. Getting permission to do this won't change anything. I'll still be mad if they blatantly invade my privacy whether or not its a damn law. They make the laws but they don't hafta follow them.

For all I know, they could be reading my mail right now.
==============================================

In the UK it is now perfectly legal for the authorities to read all emails, track site access etc. (RIP bill). In fact it is a requirement of any UK ISP to instal software & hardware to allow this to take place. One thing that puzzles me about this is that do governments think that terrorists & serious criminals are really going to be caught by this? Sure, you can catch a few naiive petty criminals, and possibly a few stupid terrorists, but most know how to disguise their activities if they want to. I'm sure most people on this fora know how to be annonymous and/or send something securely if they want to (PGP is OK, but there are better methods which are almost impossible to crack).

[ThePreacher]

Sure, you could argue that if Im innocent and guilt free then what do I have to worry about? But who decides if Im a criminal or not?

I am a criminal. Maybe we all are, and who says that one day the software pirating that I do(installing one copy of windows98se on 5 machines, burning and selling music CDs to my friends made from mp3s, burning copies of Hoyle Casino, SimCity 3000, and RollerCoaster Tycoon for personal use) will not bite me on the ass one day and land me in jail. Hell they could be monitoring this site, and I might have a rude awakening tommorrow morning. I Doubt it though. By the way I WAS JOKING about everything I just said. I am an upstanding church going citizen.