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Thread: British Intelligence on Iraq

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2001

    British Intelligence on Iraq

    Last Wednesday, Colin Powell asked extra attention from the Security Council for a report from the British "intelligence" services. He thanked the UK for their 'exquisit' report on the Iraqi misguidance of UN inspectors. Not that big a deal... untill someone discovered they made a mistake. A big one. See for yourself:

    The British report

    Now let's compare that to this text:

    Report written by Ibrahim al-Marashi, an Iraq-American student, in September last year

    British intelligence my a@@

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Well history learns that is politics... Pushing as hard as you can in a direction you want to. I already read on many places now the so called "evidence" is outdated, vague, non official, copied and etc. I don't suply links, find them yerself. It's in dutch newspapers, if you get those.

    I think this points to this that the only motivation to even bother attacking Iraq is an economical one. Political and other wars mostly are about economical things... Well that's our world ... Political leaders of two of the most powerfull nations on earth showing student reports (with all grammatical and spelling mistakes included) as evidence to attack another nation...

    Have a nice day.
    Double Dutch

  3. #3
    As the British we know everything that goes on !

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2002


    Hey Neg,

    I dont know if you read my post yesterday,

    but I totally agree with you, Tony Blair and Bush are expecting their citizens to be total idiots and accept anything they publish. And they expect the parliament to vote on war based on this information ?

    Surprisingly there are some gullible citizens who believe and support it!

    Itís a bit worrying!!!


  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Hilarious and yet ridiculous for most of the actors ...
    i just hope that the public demonstration last weekend would have taught something to some leaders...

    but let's observe the future a bit:
    -Autralia: their prime minister got censured by the parlement because he sent troups without their acknowledgement... after the protest and demonstration of this weekend, i don't think that the prime minister will have much of a future (in politics there ..)
    -UK: blair is in big trouble, he is in complete opposition with his people which would only be openminded to a fully backed UN operation. out of the window blair, plus the economy is bad oups that's everywhere...
    -spain: dito with aznar ( btw spain is a republic accoriding to bush; jeff not jw so i guess it runs in the family: they know and understand nothing outisde of the states)
    -france: go chirac! most popular as ever but he cannot afford to put a veto at the UN after all it's just iraq.
    -turquey: they are so scared of iraq that they are ocupying some of northern iraq's border you know those famous no fly zone (not sanctioned by the UN) even belgium could not buy that one.
    (As for the secretary of nato he is a goner and that's it he has no weight no matter what)
    -"the new europe" they will have to deal with angered french& german negotiators for all negs in europe oupsiiii needless to say that the Us cannot help them there ...

    And finaly the biggest winner is
    -US:bush cannot back out becasue he spent too much $$$ sending at least 100 000 gi's there and they cannot come back empty handed... i mean the oil field are right there !
    also he'd look like a fool (wait he already does) and getting a man like collin powel humiliated in public is not good for bush. can he afford to back out no so he will do it and yes the us will invade iraq but it will cost them so much in negociation concession that the price $$ might be too big. To get a new resolution will require 11 votes out of the 15 possible. Right now the us have 2 (themselves and uk) that's a lot of cash to spend there....
    assembly.... digital dna ?

  6. #6
    AO Ancient: Team Leader
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Er.... Neg old chap..... dear moderator..... <snikker>

    Look here

    Specifically see my answer..... It might shed a little light on a possible answer to this apparent embarrassment......
    Don\'t SYN us.... We\'ll SYN you.....
    \"A nation that draws too broad a difference between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards, and its fighting done by fools.\" - Thucydides

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    I have just read the news.
    Strangely, the journalists think the situation has been totally changed by the public manifestations of this week (it has been the first time I read a good opinion about Chirac in an international journal for a very long time now).
    But Bush repeats he will attack again and again. It must be an obsession. Perhaps we should advice him to consult a psychiatrist.

    Life is boring. Play NetHack... --more--

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    I received this in an email. An american sympathizer... FINALLY

    Thank God that somebody gets it!
    Subject: FW: Good reading...letter from England

    No matter your views on President Bush's stand regarding potential war with IRAQ, this, from an English journalist, is very interesting. For those of you who aren't familiar with the UK's Daily Mirror, this is a notoriously left-wing daily that is normally not supportive of the Colonials across the Atlantic.

    Tony Parsons, Daily Mirror September 11, 2002

    ONE year ago, the world witnessed a unique kind of broadcasting -- the mass murder of thousands, live on television. As a lesson in the pitiless cruelty of the human race, September 11 was up there with Pol Pot's mountain of skulls in Cambodia, or the skeletal bodies stacked like garbage in the Nazi concentration
    camps. An unspeakable act so cruel, so calculated and so utterly merciless that surely the world could agree on one thing - nobody deserves this fate. Surely there could be consensus: the victims were truly innocent, the perpetrators truly evil.

    But to the world's eternal shame, 9/11 is increasingly seen as America's comeuppance. Incredibly, anti-Americanism has increased over the last year.
    There has always been a simmering resentment to the USA in this country too loud, too rich, too full of themselves and so much happier than Europeans but it has become an epidemic. And it seems incredible to me. More than that, it turns my stomach.

    America is this country's greatest friend and our staunchest ally. We are bonded to the US by culture, language and blood. A little over half a century ago, around half a million Americans died for our freedoms, as well as their own. Have we forgotten so soon? And exactly a year ago, thousands of
    ordinary men, women and children - not just Americans, but from dozens of countries were butchered by a small group of religious fanatics. Are we so quick to betray them?

    What touched the heart about those who died in the twin towers and on the planes was that we recognized them. Young fathers and mothers, somebody's son and somebody's daughter, husbands and wives, and children, some unborn.

    And these people brought it on themselves? And their nation is to blame for their meticulously planned slaughter?
    These days you don't have to be some dust-encrusted nut job in Kabul or Karachi or Finsbury Park to see America as the Great Satan. The anti-American alliance is made up of self-loathing liberals who blame the Americans for every ill in the Third World, and conservatives suffering from power-envy, bitter
    that the world's only superpower can do what it likes without having to ask permission. The truth is that America has behaved with enormous restraint since September 11.

    Remember, remember.

    Remember the gut-wrenching tapes of weeping men phoning their wives to say, "I love you," before they were burned alive.

    Remember those people leaping to their deaths from the top of burning skyscrapers.

    Remember the hundreds of firemen buried alive. Remember the smiling face of that beautiful little girl who was on one of the planes with her mum.

    Remember, remember - and realize that America has never retaliated for 9/11 in anything like the way it could have.

    So a few al-Qaeda tourists got locked without a trial in Camp X-ray? Pass the Kleenex...

    So some Afghan wedding receptions were shot up after they merrily fired their semi-automatics in a sky full of American planes? A shame, but maybe next time they should stick to confetti.

    AMERICA could have turned a large chunk of the world into a parking lot. That it didn't is a sign of strength. American voices are already being raised against attacking Iraq - that's what a democracy is for. How many in the Islamic world will have a minute's silence for the slaughtered innocents of 9/11? How many Islamic leaders will have the guts to say that the mass murder of 9/11 was an abomination?

    When the news of 9/11 broke on the West Bank, those freedom-loving Palestinians were dancing in the street. America watched all of that - and didn't push the button. We should thank the stars that America is the most powerful nation in the world. I still find it incredible that 9/11 did not provoke all-out

    Not a "war on terrorism." A real war.

    The fundamentalist dudes are talking about "opening the gates of hell," if America attacks Iraq. Well, America could have opened the gates of hell like you wouldn't believe. The US is the most militarily powerful nation that ever strode the face of the earth. The campaign in Afghanistan may have been
    less than perfect and the planned war on Iraq may be misconceived.

    But don't blame America for not bringing peace and light to these wretched
    countries. How many democracies are there in the Middle East, or in the
    world? You can count them on the fingers of one hand - assuming you haven't
    any chopped off for minor shoplifting.

    I love America, yet America is hated. I guess that makes me Bush's poodle.
    But I would rather be a dog in New York City than a Prince in Riyadh. Above all, America is hated because it is what every country wants to be - rich, free, strong, open, and optimistic. Not ground down by the past, or religion, or some caste system. America is the best friend this country ever had and we
    should start remembering that.

    Or do you really think the USA is the root of all evil? Tell it to the loved ones of the men and women who leaped to their death from the burning towers. Tell it to the nursing mothers whose husbands died on one of the hijacked planes, or were ripped apart in a collapsing skyscraper. And tell it to the hundreds of young widows whose husbands worked for the New York Fire Department.

    To our shame, George Bush gets a worse press than Saddam Hussein. Once we were told that Saddam gassed the Kurds, tortured his own people and set up rape-camps in Kuwait. Now we are told he likes Quality Street. Save me the orange center, oh mighty one!

    Remember, remember, September 11. One of the greatest atrocities in human history was committed against America.

    No, do more than remember. Never forget
    You\'re either a 0 or a 1, alive or dead

  9. #9
    Priapistic Monk KorpDeath's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Hey, Negative. How do I give every antipoint I have ever had to one person?

    No matter how much crap I take for having a baseless argument (even though it's only my opinion) I will always be a proud American. Always.


    I will never forget.
    Mankind have a great aversion to intellectual labor; but even supposing knowledge to be easily attainable, more people would be content to be ignorant than would take even a little trouble to acquire it.
    - Samuel Johnson

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2002

    Re: British Intelligence on Iraq

    Sorry this is little off topic here but I felt I should point this out this from Negatives post:

    Report written by Ibrahim al-Marashi, an Iraq-American student, in September last year
    A student ? Where did it say he was a student ? At the bottom of the report it says;

    Ibrahim al-Marashi is a research associate at the Center for Non-Proliferation Studies in Monterey, California as well as a lecturer at the US Naval Postgraduate School. He is currently working on a project on Iraqi intelligence operations in northern Iraq and Kuwait.
    I know what a lecturer is but a Research Associate ?? - I might be old and sometimes not all that wise - so I checked up on what is needed to qualify as a Research Associate in a selected field and found this for a Research Associate with LifeSpan BioSciences Tissue Bank to give me some sort of idea:


    * Bachelor's Degree (B.S.) in related field.
    * Knowledge of vertebrate anatomy required.
    * Knowledge of pathology procedures, medical terminology, and histology procedures preferred.
    * PC skills including MS Excel, email, and experience using search tools.
    * Data entry skills preferred.
    * Detail oriented, organized, adaptable, and flexible.
    * Strong interpersonal and communication skills.
    * Ability to work well independently and as a member of a team.
    * Microscopy experience helpful.

    Whoever quoted Mr Ibrahim al-Marashi a student, may not be doing him or his work justice, the man is obviously qualified in his field of expertise beyond that of a student - please tell me if I am wrong.

    Found this here on the man:

    Ibrahim Marashi is a Research Associate at the Center for Nonproliferation Studies (CNS) of the Monterey Institute of International Studies. His research focuses on the diffusion of nuclear, biological, and chemical weapons and missile technologies in the Middle East, particularly Iraq and Iran.

    Marashi received a MA in Political Science at the Arab Studies Center at Georgetown in 1997. He has a BA in History and Near Eastern Studies from the University of California Los Angeles.

    Prior to joining CNS, Marashi worked with the Center for Middle Eastern Studies at Harvard University on a project classifying captured Iraqi state documents. He was also a researcher on Iran-Iraq affairs at the US State Department, Congressional Research Service, and National Defense University.

    Looks to me that the man may know his subject matter but whether a government should use the material without consultation with the author as to recency and correctness - well that another thing.

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