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Thread: Your Views On Hacking People

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2003

    Your Views On Hacking People

    I think this is a very good security website,
    I think the mane intension of this website is for people to learn how to secure there computers and to learn about computers in general.

    The reason i am a member of this website is because i want to learn how to secure my computer and i want to learn to hack so i can perform these attacks against my own computers and so i can begin to better understand how hackers/script kiddies break into my computer so i can better learn how to stop these kinds of attacks against my own computers.

    While most people here do come here for this very purpose and maybe found this website by typing "Computer Security" into google can you honestly say this is how all the people here got to this website?.

    Some people have openly admitted here on the forums that they had searched on google for: SubSeven/Exploits/Viruses/Trojans or information on these types of subjects to be malicious and to cause harm to others and that is how they have come to be a member of this site.But have turned there intensions since meeting many of the people here who face these kinds of attacks everyday.

    Also even someone who has hacked the WhiteHouse may visit this website for Computer/Computer security information to use it to brake into computers and commit computer crime against others and we may also have bank robbers and defacers here aswell.

    While information on this website could be used for good or bad its up to u how u use it.

    This is a fact that many people here at antionline will know of that have been around here awhile and seen the kinds of threads like: "How Do I Hack Hotmail So I Can Show My Friends How 1337 I Am" or "How Do I Use SubSeven"?.

    Well i thought about it and i have read many defacments like: "I 0wn J00 Please Visit irc.***.com Shouts To Everyone I Know And Am Cool With,
    Sorry Admin This .gov Is Very Insecure Please Pay Closer Attention To Security".

    I have read interviews about these kinds of people called "White Hat Hackers" and they believe they are doing a good thing by warning the admin.

    The reason for this thread is to try to get people here to explain why they are here and what there intensions are and why they think they are doing a good thing for the computer world.

    For example it could be: "Hi i work for the M.O.D for my local city and have been doing
    PC Servicing for about 2 years now,my employer wants me to make a career move and become an admin which involves building,maintaing,and securing are office computers and gave me this web address to antionline".

    Or: "Hi i work for NASA where i am a computer security consaltant,in my spare time i hack .gov and .mil webservers and deface them to show the admin how insecure his/her webservers are and i also leave instructions on how he/she can go about securing there box.
    I think im doing a good thing cuz i learn how to brake the security which helps me learn and improve in my job and i help the admin by getting there before someone with more malicious intensions gets their and causes damage to their company computers".

    The thing is that its not always a good thing to do like the person explains above because when the administers boss finds out the administer could lose his/her job.

    The purpose of this thread is for all Antionline members of all areas to come together and explain what they get up to,how they came across this site and what their positions are ect:
    BlackHat Hacker/WhiteHat Hacker/ScriptKiddie/Admin/Computer Security Consaltant,and if ur a WhiteHat Hacker or ScriptKiddie or BlackHat Hacker or ur defacing websites and you think ur doing a good thing
    please explain why u think ur doing a good thing and some of the admins here could explain why they may not think ur doing a good thing and how u maybe causing them problems.

    The reason i created this thread is because most hackers and web defacers think their doing a good cause for the computer community when the victim may be gratful for their actions or may of lost them their job.

    ***This thread is a non senstational thread u can assign positive antipoints to this thread but if someone says they are a defacer please dont flame/neg them instead have a talk with them,try to find out why they do what they are doing and if they think it is for a good cause and try to explain what their doing might not be so good.***

    P.S Do not give anyone negs for what they post in this thread i am trying to get a good discussion going here and find out abit more about some of our members if someone is a defacer and ur trying to explain to them what they are doing is wrong and they turn against u please ignore them i am trying to make this an argument free thread.

    Also if ur a active member of this site and u do deface under a different name but dont want to expose ur self to ur buddies here at antionline then please join antionline again under a different name and come back and make an anonymous post in this thread.

  2. #2
    nice post there... maybe your right we can have a good discussion on this.... yous got those classification of hackers and wat they can do but all i can say is this is my personal opinion hope that other will not take ths as a serious one.. we got different classification of hackers , like wat above said.. but you can find only few hackers who obey the hackers manifesto or the code .. what i can say that in the cyber world or in the net we got lots of scriptkiddies,wannabehackers, etc.. they use downloaded software in the net but dont care what the software or the program really does, they just use and use those program without knowledge so they turn them self to be a scriptkiddies..

  3. #3
    Just a Virtualized Geek MrLinus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Redondo Beach, CA
    n00bie, your post is somewhat a jumble of ideas but I think I get the gist of it. If people originally came here to learn something malicious (for good or bad reasons) and why they stayed as well as what their background is.

    The reason i created this thread is because most hackers and web defacers think their doing a good cause for the computer community when the victim may be gratful for their actions or may of lost them their job.
    Specifically, you seem to target those that "hack back", those that do "hacktivism" and those that deface for "moralistic" purposes (at least that seems to be what you are conveying).

    One of the tenets of this site, albeit that sometimes it's hard to find, is that white hats (or security admins) should understand from the black hats (bad guy types -- defacers, exploiters, etc.) point of view of how to break into systems. When you understand the "how" something is done, then you can better lock down a system. I personally haven't done this on live systems save for the occassional audit and classroom lab settings (for the purpose of wargames). It was this attitude that drew me here when I first visited a long time ago (in a place far, far, far away) when I was an admin. I've since remained because of the vast knowledge that is here.

    Anyways, sounds like this might be an interesting discussion.
    Goodbye, Mittens (1992-2008). My pillow will be cold without your purring beside my head
    Extra! Extra! Get your FREE copy of Insight Newsletter||MsMittens' HomePage

  4. #4
    other web defacer and hacker help the community like what white hat hakecrs does they tell the admin that their site has a vulnerable part and others may take advantages of it.. for others what they have done is a criminal act.. but i guess if some1 jst tell you that your security is in a bad condition or easy to hack maybe you can thank the one that did say it cause he is concern about your security, and your company may suffer if you dont act quickly..

  5. #5
    rebmeM roineS enilnOitnA steve.milner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    From a personal viewpoint I can see no reason to hack anything you don't own (or the comnpany you work for)

    However, with that said, I am only human and there are times when anger overcomes good sense, and actions become rationalised with phrases such as 'they started this' and 'well if they didn't send spam'......

    But that doesn't make it right, nor does it make it legal!

    If a site other than your own is vunerable to an exploit it is the responisibility of those maintaining the site to secure it, it is not for you to probe & find out if it's secure etc.

    In an ideal world there would be no need to secure anything at all, but I guess life has moved on from the time we could all leave our front door open all day.

    And although this is perverse, if you do leave your door open, and someone steals something, even if you know who stole it and also that their door is open, it's not legal to get it back - you need the cops for that!
    IT, e-commerce, Retail, Programme & Project Management, EPoS, Supply Chain and Logistic Services. Yorkshire.

  6. #6
    Analysing your post, I find that you are not as illiterate as you appear, please do not try to pretend you are a 13yo with a speech impediment. Be concise, we don't care if you are 45 and working for the .gov , if you are honestly trying to learn about security then continue, there is nothing wrong with correct english.

    .....Brain Failure....dumping core.... z z z

  7. #7
    HeadShot Master N1nja Cybr1d's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Boston, MA
    Well, let me get a share of this. krang, i'm not picking on you but i just dont understand what on earth you're talking about?

    Back to the topic: If i was discover a vulnerability in a website, which indeed could let me deface it, There would be no need whatsoever to deface the website just to let the admin know his/her security measures suck. I could send an email saying that while surfing around you came across this vulnerabily and whatnot. I haven't defaced any websites myself but i have come across a few sites with the uni-code vulnerability. (websites that were never updated lol). Many people take a different approach when discovering vulnerabilites such as the ones we're discussing right now. As for hacking, you could say i've used many tools/methods of getting certain information that i've needed. (one occurence was when someone was stalking my GF on AIM and i needed to know who it was. The problem was resolved outside the cyberworld).

    Antionline is a GREAT place to learn about security. Stick around and you'll learn a lot.

    My 2 cent

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    n00bie, i think that all hackers (white or black hat), are driven by the desire to take stuff apart and figure out how stuff works. I consider script kiddies to be not of this class of people. I consider them to be people who download a program that someone else wrote just to see if it really does what it says it can and so that they can impress people with their 1337 skills. They don't particularly value the cultivation of knowledge from such a thing, they just want to gleefully break into stuff.

    Hackers, whom i have a great deal of respect for (whether they are white or black hat), value the process of figuring out how something works and proving that it works. I don't agree with defacing websites or breaking into other peoples computers, but i do respect the people that are able to. That may sound kind of funny that i would respect someone i disagree with, but really, i only disagree with the actions they take. At the core, they're still in it to learn how it works.

    I think that our definition of a white-hat hacker differs somewhat. I consider defacement to be something a black-hat hacker would do. White hat hackers would find the vuln and alert the sysadmins to the security hole.

    But, this is where things get fuzzy. Since you really have no right to break into the system in the first place, they can sue and jail your ass faster than you can say 1337. But i think corporations should be more security aware and be thankful that the hole was identified but not exploited for any malicious purpose. I don't think they should sue them for the cost of what it takes to repair the hole. I'm not a firm believer in 'independent auditing', but i don't think it's a bad thing if the corporation suffers no loss of data or downtime and as a result of this harmless activity, are given a list of security problems that should be fixed.

    I think some corporations have the mentality of 'If they can't find the hole, it's not a problem, and that means i don't have to pay money to fix it.' Well, that mentality is really not that great either. I do not think that people should provide proof-of-concept code so that any hunyuck can use it and get into the system. This is where i draw the line between white hat and black hat. Black hats would post full code and directions on usage so that anybody could exploit it. White hats may post some general idea and directions so that if someone wanted to do a bit of work and verify it they could, but a script kiddie who isn't interested in learning about the system itself would be disuaded from trying to do anything with the directions since it would require work.

    Anyways, back to your original point of what brings me to antionline. I guess i consider myself somewhat of a white-hat hacker but not a very skilled one mind you. I found a link to here in some of the books i was reading. I think there was a link in the back of my 'Beginning programming for Dummies' and another one in 'Steal This Computer Book 2'. Amidst my coding and gaming and amateur crypto stuff, i ended up here. Not too much of a story to it. My name is just the name of a fake software company i published some of my programs under so that people would take it seriously. Now, it seems old, perhaps i'll get a new name at some point, but right now it's okay.

    Btw, interesting topic idea, it's sure to be a good read.
    Is there a sum of an inifinite geometric series? Well, that all depends on what you consider a negligible amount.

  9. #9
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2003

    Yep thats what im saying.
    Please exuse me if i have confused anyone with my long
    lines of mumble jumble as i am one to be constantly
    thinking about things and i am always thinking what if?.
    But for this very reason i think this is the reason
    i am into computers,computer security and hacking cuz i am
    a curious person and i like to learn and find out how
    things work.


    Dont criticise the way people talk as i cannot see a
    point to ur question.

    I will try to understand what ur trying to say,
    i am actually a 19 year old from the uk,i am currently
    unemployed and have never had a computer job.

    Dont try to insult me by saying i am a 13 year old and
    also i dont think i have a speach impediment its just i am constantly
    thinking about stuff and i had alot to explain in my post
    thats the reason i have 3 different questions in one post
    and MsMittens was trying to piece it all together i find
    it hard to be creative but like my school report card always
    used to say: "You can do if it you put the effort in."


    Why did u neg me with the message: "Good idea "?,
    was this a mistake?,were u meant to assign positve
    antipoints?,if not please explain why u neged me with
    that message.

    Also if ur not looking into a computer career i dont think it really matters if u learn to hack or not,as long as u keep on learning about computers which u enjoy thats proberly the only thing that counts unless u want to use those types of skills to "own" somebody :|.

    If negging me was a mistake could u assign me a few antipoints?.

  10. #10
    yeah...we have to learn the hacker's language in order to stop them from doing it!!!

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