On the subject of Iraq...

[Negative]

Mr. Waring > You can say all you want about CNN and Fox, but by reporting those figures, they were doing the only thing they're good at: being the public voice of the American administration. 30% of all Iraqi's now having a satellite dish must be something the administration is proud of, therefore it was reported

There is no "news" on TV here in America. There are commercials filled up with faits divers. You can't take a newscast that is sponsored by McDonald's serious.

[amnesiac]

No matter when the troops get pulled out of that place, it's going to become a mess anyway. So its a waste of people and money.
The billions of dollars worth of damage we have done overthere is a tab that's gotta be picked up by either the Americans and the Brittish or the UN. You can't just go, blow up a place and leave. You're responsible for its restoration. I remember Japan picked up the bill during the gulf war...which is kind of curious to me, considering they're there again and their reasons aren't what you would call, visible. it's gonna be kind of interesting to see who will do it this time, since America is going broke.

[groovicus]

since America is going broke.

THUNK!!!

That's the sound of my ass hitting the floor...I just laughed it off..

[UnderClockdMind]

First point: It had to be done!!! Saddam and the UN J@#$edoff for 10 years. After the Gulf War he
was supposed to do alot of things, but did not. The inspectors were should have been
allowed to go any where they wanted in Irqa to do their thing, yet were hardly allowed
any where.
second: We win when we set up a new government that functions.
Third: gold eagal I know you ment know dissrespect, but harsh and not kewl
Fourth: CNN is liberal, FOX is "fair and ballenced" (right-wing) at least get the facts right.
Last: HOOAH!....Go Green!..... (if you don't get it figure it out)

side note: I'll be making my rotation through after OBC in two years.

[Negative]

Here's an interesting read on Fox News ("Is Fox CNN Lite?"). There's just as unprofessional and Disney-ish as CNN.

First: "It" had to be done... what had to be done? Overthrowing Saddam? I don't think anyone will disagree with that. And remember that those inspectors were UN inspectors... were they J@#$ing off as well?

Second: setting up a new government that functions (almost sounds like a contradictione in terminis) means that the Iraqi people will have won. In a case like this, there's no government that wins or looses... not anymore.

[pwaring]

Having watched CNN on several occassions (as we can get it on Satellite over here) and read the web site as well, I can definitely say that they are not liberal. I find it quite amusing though that if you read their profile of Ralph Naper you will see that his biography is identical to John Kerry's. Looks like some unprofessional CNN webmaster decided to just copy/paste without checking.

[RoadClosed]

Part of me agrees with all off you, we should leave and let them burn each other off the planet. But I haven't reached that alternative yet, since that is what will happen. I am curious at the report that Iraq has 30 percent of it's population in front of satelite dishes. That seems to go against the growing trend that the entire population is uprising against the evil empire. This is perhaps not newsworthy, but it astounds me because the media before was controlled by an opressive political party and if things are so bad over there, why are so many people indulging in such luxury as satelite TV?

If I can't respect the marines and feel greif for them, and I don't want to country of Iraq to fall into a scene out of "Road Warrior" what am I to do?

[amnesiac]

Well, one theory i'd like to throw about percentages here, most rebellions are caused and initiated by minorities. The majority always seem to comply.
Another point I wanna reply too that some of you brought up is about this victory theme. How can you head towards victory, when you can't actually define it. What is victory at Iraq at this point of the game? Was it necessary to overthrow saddam? Well, it's necessary to overthrow any type of tyrany, but you need a plan and we went there without one and now, as a result, anything that was expected, was assumed. None of it turned out to be right. For example, we assumed that the reconstruction of Iraq would be financed on its oil revenues. We assumed that 77,000 police and army officers in Iraq would be backing us up right now. We still assume that we will get out of there by June 30th. We assumed we would be looked at as liberators, not conquerors.

[groovicus]

We still assume that we will get out of there by June 30th.

lmao..do you stay up late at night thinking up things like that? Quote one (credible) source that states we will be out of there by June 30th? June 30th of which year?

I think the activities over there are proceeding exactly as many people thought they would...I haven't been surprised by anything that has happened so far....

[RoadClosed]

I dont recall anyone saying we would be out by June, I remember that deadline being the proclaimation that Iraq will have a working government by June. It's always been the plan to have coalition forces used past June 30th. To my knowledge no date has ever been set to remove them.

Here is a cold number on rebellian, the communists in Hungry only had a about a 4-7 percent support base, so yes a small minority can effectively rule a passive population.

Even if you had a plan in place, assumptions would have been made, right or wrong the assumtions used as examples, sound like a plan. In fact a deadline with some goals also sounds like a plan. I might agree that a term conquerer vs. liberator might be used, if insurgent forces weren't tyranical in their own views. I am not sure how protecting the loosly held government from revolutionary forces that will single out a specific muslem sect and destroy the rest is considered conguering.

In addition I am not sure how one could come to the conclusion the reconstruction cost will not result in oil revenues. That would be a guess which is OK, I would assume those oil rigs are working and controlled by security forces, perhaps not. But it seems logical. Insurgency of "war lord like" Clerics does not equate to the Government and Iraq police forces, not suporting us. In fact the insurgents are killing them just as much.