The Problem of Evil

[TheSpecialist]

I say, "I am just an average citizen intil the truth comes out or am face to face with the consequences of my actions."

They always have these unusually small tables at nearly all of the conferences I've been to. One time, I sat down and the conversation I had with a complete stranger was well... what can I say with me its always interesting but this went rather odd. And ever since that day, I am always reminded of the move heat because of this moment in the movie...

Vincent: You know, we are sitting here like a couple of regular fellows and if I have to go out there and put you down, I'll tell you, I won't like it. But if it's between you and some poor bastard whose wife you're gonna turn into a widow, buddy, you are going down.

Neil: There is a flip side to that coin. What if you do get me boxed in and I will have to put you down? Cause no matter what, you will not get in my way. We've been face to face, yeah. But I will not hesitate, not for a second.

[Sick Dwarf]

Originally posted here by rcgreen
However you personally define "evil", does its existence argue for or against the existence of a supreme being, or is it, as I say, still a philosophical puzzle whatever your religious system may be?

I don't see how individual taste argues for or against anything. Besides the fact that man forces his own oppinions and definitions of good and evil on other human beings because of religious convictions, it has nothing to do with any philosophical discussions covering a "supreme being," or the creation of the world for that matter.

Originally posted here by rcgreen
I wasn't sure what term to use. But just out of curiosity, what is the difference between an Atheist and a Satanist, if neither believes in any god?

Satanists are basically atheists who choose to accept man as he is, without the hypocracy most religions offer. The name "Satanism" was chosen to shock those it opposed, although this has turned against the philosophy with misconceptions and the way humans tend to assume things without hearing the facts. The term "Satan" basically represents man's own nature. This document goes deeper into things: http://www.purgingtalon.com/nlm/cosinfopack2.pdf

Originally posted here by Donkey Punch
Satanists do believe in god. Atheists do not.

You are referring to those who believe in christianity, but are simply choosing "the other side." These are Luciferians or Devil-worshippers, NOT Satanists. I could go into a yes/no discussion with you, but I'll recommend you to do some research instead.

Originally posted here by Tedob1
nothing is evil, except what man creates. everything else just is. Earth quakes, volcanos and tidal waves are not evil, just the result of the earth slowly moving. no evil in nature. even oil is not evil, only mans lust for the money that can be had by it's sale are evil. look at the hurricanes that hit haiti. a true tradgedy but the only evil there has been created by man...stealing, killing. the hurricane just set the scene

hitler was evil, saddam is evil, bigotry is evil.

You are assuming man is unnatural, and that his actions are not part of nature. Evil is a definition that changes throughout time and is different for every person. Hitler wasn't called evil by his generals. Hitler wasn't called evil by millions of germans. America was, though. A lot of americans call arabs evil. A lot of arabs call americans evil. I'm sure saddam's wife didn't call him evil. I'm sure his sons didn't either, although I am sure that some iraqi citizens called his sons evil. Then again, others did not. Evil is in the eye of the beholder. You are simply explaining YOUR particular definition of evil.

[Donkey Punch]

Franky: I have done research. From what I understand, like any other religion, there are holes in the philosophy. It says one thing, but actually says another. It never ceases to maze me, and why I have not chosen to join anything.

From the Church Of Satan web site: http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/NineStatements.html

2. Satan represents vital existence instead of spiritual pipe dreams!

That suggests they do not belive in a spirtual pipe dreams, fair enough, but then it says this:

9. Satan has been the best friend the Church has ever had, as He has kept it in business all these years!

A little contradiction there, don't you think? If you want to get into a theological discussion, be my guest.

[AngelicKnight]

Well, I am a christian, but this question does not "make me squirm". Like any other good question, it's worth a good consideration and analysis. In a nutshell, I believe this:

1) The problem is that evil is viewed as a creative thing, a "something". However, evil from the theological perspective is a lack of something, a sort of moral black hole if you will. As God is perfect, righteous, and holy -- then evil is the absence of that. So did God create an absence of Himself? That very question makes no sense. He is, and evil is what occurs when He is kept out of the picture.

2) Since we have free will, we can choose God, or not choose Him. We can choose good (God) or evil (absence of God).

So again, evil is the absence of God, more or less. God didn't create evil, as obviously He didn't create the absence of Himself.

[cacosapo]

I cant accept that universe is the eternal God x Evil, since this dispute will put Evil and God at same level - so Evil its a second "God"? bah, nonsense

Evil does not exist. im with angelicknight (first time on this kind of subject )

Since we have free will, we can choose God, or not choose Him. We can choose good (God) or evil (absence of God).

its just a creation of human being to materialize the option for the "other side" (not God).

I also dont believe in punishement (from God). Its not that Jesus teached us. God is only love and wont punish anyone. so Hell cant exist too.

[Donkey Punch]

That's still contradictory. If you are so-called absent from God, then why care about it? The church of satan literature yaps about how they hate Christinaity and small minded stuff, yet they talk about it. I have read the satanic bible, and that book is filled with more mumbo jumbo than the bible could ever conjure.

People can choose to be a satanist, I do not give a rat's ass, but like anything else, it is full of holes. This discussion is not about what religion is right or wrong, it is about evil. Evil to me anyway is selfishness. If you look at the "evil" things that take place, from my experience has been from selfish motives. Killing people, rape, genocide, child molestation, etc. come from selfish motives. There is nothing wrong with loving yourself and doing things that please you, but there has to be a line drawn somewhere. Satanists although promote indulgence and that the so-called sins lead to gratification... ok, then if that is the case, is lying, murder, and other so-called sins of other religions an indulgence? According to them, they do not harm animals and children, but they are still showing some level of self-control. Fine. Like I said, that is the reason why I never joined this and abandoned other religion... it is just too full of BS.

I also dont believe in punishement (from God). Its not that Jesus teached us. God is only love and wont punish anyone. so Hell cant exist too.

Okay, then what about the so-called judgement where the "evil" people that did not pass the muster get thrown into the lake of fire and other stuff?

[AngelicKnight]

I disagree with Caco somewhat...Hell is the eternal "location" that is entirely absent of God. Jesus did teach punishment as well -- those that choose a life apart from God are then left to go to the one place absent of God in order to fulfill their choice...that one place being hell.

Which relates to the other question "Why does God send people to hell?" Well actually, He doesn't. We send ourselves to hell. We choose Godlessness, and such is the very definition of hell.

[Donkey Punch]

Hmm, so absense of god is hell. I have heard all kinds of definitions of hell ranging from listening to John Denver records, Hades meaning the ruler of the dead and Sheol meaning to simply die. I do not know...

[AngelicKnight]

No, hell is definately disco music.

[cacosapo]

Originally posted here by AngelicKnight
No, hell is definately disco music.

hey! im from that age!

no, hell is here. We start on "hell" and go up.

kinda like on Doris Lessing' Shikasta.