To Vista or not to Vista? that is the question?

[nihil]

I am not sure whether this belongs here, or in "Hardware" as it covers a bit of both.

An interesting discussion on whether to go to Vista for a new machine, or to stick with the old XP OS?

http://news.zdnet.com/2100-3513_22-6161250.html

[vanman]

A difficult decision altogether i think,as was the case with all the other releases of windows too..Just when you get comfortable using the one the next release is only weeks away..I have also noticed here in SA that flyers from leading pc retailers now sell vista with most of their new pc,s or recommend it..My personal choice would be to still have XP PROF and make a dual boot with VISTA.That way you can gradually move towards vista when you are good and ready..Question though from my side anyway is..are they going to share and talk to one another??

[Moira]

That's the setup I currently have on my pcs. The laptop only has 2 days to go till activation and I still haven't received my free upgrade from moduslink yet, so I guess that machine will be XP until I receive the offiicial copy (I just put on the copy I bought for my main PC for now). I might even try activating it - chances are MS won't be too fussy.

My SFF has a dual boot which is very much an XP pro machine with just a small partition for Vista Ultimate. It's the computer the kids use and I don't think other users will want to grapple with Vista yet. My dual core here is just running Vista Home Premium which is going very well indeed. It didn't seem to like dual booting with XP, so I plan to put Suse or Ubuntu on the space I'd set aside for XP tomorrow.

I'm happy that my own computer is running Vista so well, I don't need to think about having XP on at all, as I've got completely used to Vista now. I find the various computers talk to each other extremely well - the data drives can be seen whether I've booted into Vista or XP on the SFF for instance. In fact the operating system drives/partitions are visible too. Right now, I'm making an Acronis image backup of the XP OS on the laptop and storing it on the F drive on the SFF, which is currently booted into Vista Ultimate, but I'd be able to do exactly the same operation if I had the PC booted into XP.

Vista isn't really that big a change from XP - nothing like Windows 3.1 to 95, or 98/Me to XP was. It doesn't take long to get used to.

[Cider]

Vista runs optimal @ 4gb ram, so it might be a better idea to wait abit and then upgrade fully

[Relyt]

Vista runs optimal @ 4gb ram...

lol...

However W98 gets all fuxy when you go over 750mb....

[HTRegz]

Vista runs optimal @ 4gb ram, so it might be a better idea to wait abit and then upgrade fully

I really hate when people make stupid obscure comments... In a 32-bit world, although the theoretical support is 4GB of RAM, you can't actually address the full 4GB... You see PCI devices share the addresses, so depending on your PCI devices you can actually only address 3 - 3.5GB of RAM making the remainder completely useless.

As for Vista... I know people running it just fine on 512MB of RAM (you just have to live without Aero).... I'm running it with full Aero support on 1GB of RAM and it runs beautifully... The only time I run into problems is with GL-based games and that's because of Microsofts current method for supporting GL (since my GL card does't have manufacturer support)... Microsoft uses DirectX as a GL wrapper which gives you horrid performance on GL-based games..

Moira: Your comment about 512MB not being enough because you see how much is used... Example.. I use 50% of my RAM on boot... I have 1GB which means Vista takes 512MB (this is including the SUA tools starting up, Defender running, Automatic Updates downloading, etc)... However you have to remember that that's not all being used... Operating Systems and certain applications are greedy and take more than they need.... Exchange Admins are quite experienced in this... Exchange will take all available RAM (Exchange 2000 anyways) up to 1.5GB... Vista takes 512MB but not because it needs it.. just because it's holding in it reserve.

Two additional things... I wouldn't call Vista "buggy as hell" unless you're running a beta still... It has one or two minor bugs... but it's definitely not "buggy as hell" not even close... and hardware support exists.. as long as you aren't using old hardware... This goes back to the "We want more security, which means sacrificing legacy support"... It was a trade off and one I'm glad Microsoft finally made... Which brings me to the next point regarding XP to Vista being a minor jump... Considering 3.1, 95 and even 98 were just shells that ran on DOS the OS jump was minor... XP to Vista is pretty much the biggest jump they've made... They've attempted to hide this from the end user... but you shouldn't be on a technical forum if you're taking the end user view on an operating system.

I recently blogged on the "IT Expert, who's actually an end user" playing with Vista -- http://www.computerdefense.org/?p=269

Peace,
HT

**NOTE** I understand that I appear as a Microsoft zealot these days... It's a running joke at the office because it couldn't be further from the truth... I just don't like seeing people attacking amazing work and showing such disregard and even disrespect just because they don't like the company... It's BS.

[nihil]

Hmmmmm.................

I seem to recall that Cider is running 64 bit on at least one of his machines?

I would personally go for 1.5 or 2.0GB as it will not be wasted. Now, this machine was built a few years ago, and I stuffed 1.5GB into it............ I doubt if the last 512 has ever done anything............ it boots Win2000

My personal view is that Vista is not "buggy", at least by my personal definition........... it just doesn't support legacy hardware that well..........

My view is that if you go out and buy brand new kit you will have no problems...........try "upgrade" and you probably will

[brokencrow]

Well, it seems to be quickly becoming a non-choice. Just talked to a
Dell rep who told me XP is no longer available thru them with a new PC.
That's retail to home users. The business center is closed right now,
open on Monday, regular hours. We need 30+ laptops for some field
service techs and I'm hoping XP is still available. We run a lot of software
at work on 500+ computers, and I dread the thought of having to deal
with Vista issues as understaffed as we are. Chit, we're just NOW rolling
into XP and bagging our W2K boxes (gradually).

Does anybody know M$'s plans for killing off XP Pro besides the fact
support will end sometime in 2012? Are there any new PC's available
with XP still, hexadecimal? I need some laptops...

[nihil]

Hey brokencrow I think that they will sort you, given the corporate thing.

I have sent you a PM.............. I am coming to the conclusion that we will have to look after our fellows?

Johnno

[HTRegz]

Well, it seems to be quickly becoming a non-choice. Just talked to a
Dell rep who told me XP is no longer available thru them with a new PC.
That's retail to home users. The business center is closed right now,
open on Monday, regular hours. We need 30+ laptops for some field
service techs and I'm hoping XP is still available. We run a lot of software
at work on 500+ computers, and I dread the thought of having to deal
with Vista issues as understaffed as we are. Chit, we're just NOW rolling
into XP and bagging our W2K boxes (gradually).

Does anybody know M$'s plans for killing off XP Pro besides the fact
support will end sometime in 2012? Are there any new PC's available
with XP still, hexadecimal? I need some laptops...

I'm guessing you'll still be able to buy XP for quite a while... after all you can still get licenses for 2000... Support will end in 2014... As for purchasing laptops with the OS installed... most shops I've worked at have blow away the installed OS and installed their own... It eliminates the pre-installed crap that the vendor tends to put on the computer.