Hacking: Luck or skill???

[HacTek]

Knowledge and skill dont go hand in hand.
they need to but often dont.
someone could have a high degree of skill in coding for example but not have a clue how to cause a buffer overflow in the linux kernal.

The same to in reverse. Someone could know exactly how to overflow the kernal but doesn't have the coding skill to exploit it.

These 14 y.o lamers are usually the kinda ppl who have stumbled accross a hacking site and are looking for the quick and easy way so they can show off to their friends by crashing a website.
they will use a tool that was often made by someone with the knowedge and skill to discover an exploit and abuse it thereby giving the people who are out there discovering and reporting security holes a bad name.

sorry bout my little rant but i feel quite strongly about lamers.
I've gotten in trouble coz of them before (im happy to give you details if ur interested)
L8erz
HacTek

[HacTek]

Knowledge and skill dont go hand in hand.
they need to but often dont.
someone could have a high degree of skill in coding for example but not have a clue how to cause a buffer overflow in the linux kernal.

The same to in reverse. Someone could know exactly how to overflow the kernal but doesn't have the coding skill to exploit it.

These 14 y.o lamers are usually the kinda ppl who have stumbled accross a hacking site and are looking for the quick and easy way so they can show off to their friends by crashing a website.
they will use a tool that was often made by someone with the knowedge and skill to discover an exploit and abuse it thereby giving the people who are out there discovering and reporting security holes a bad name.

sorry bout my little rant but i feel quite strongly about lamers.
I've gotten in trouble coz of them before (im happy to give you details if ur interested)
L8erz
HacTek

[the_JinX]

To be able to speak of Hacking (hacker) one needs to have skill and enthousiasm.
Else indeed as has been said before they are lamers, skriptkiddies, etc.

A real (whitehat) hacker does his thing, not for proffit or fame, but to make his **** a whole damn lot better, and to safeguard against: lamers skriptkiddies and blackhats,


hack·er1 Pronunciation Key (hkr)
n. Informal
One who is proficient at using or programming a computer; a computer buff.
One who uses programming skills to gain illegal access to a computer network or file.
One who enthusiastically pursues a game or sport: a weekend tennis hacker.
A person who enjoys exploring the details of programmable systems and how to stretch their capabilities, as opposed to most users, who prefer to learn only the minimum necessary.
One who programs enthusiastically (even obsessively) or who enjoys programming rather than just theorizing about programming.
A person capable of appreciating hack value.
A person who is good at programming quickly.
An expert at a particular program, or one who frequently does work using it or on it; as in "a Unix hacker". (Definitions 1 through 5 are correlated, and people who fit them congregate.)
An expert or enthusiast of any kind. One might be an astronomy hacker, for example.
One who enjoys the intellectual challenge of creatively overcoming or circumventing limitations.

(Deprecated) A malicious meddler who tries to discover sensitive information by poking around. Hence "password hacker", "network hacker". The correct term is cracker.

http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=Hacker

[the_JinX]

To be able to speak of Hacking (hacker) one needs to have skill and enthousiasm.
Else indeed as has been said before they are lamers, skriptkiddies, etc.

A real (whitehat) hacker does his thing, not for proffit or fame, but to make his **** a whole damn lot better, and to safeguard against: lamers skriptkiddies and blackhats,


hack·er1 Pronunciation Key (hkr)
n. Informal
One who is proficient at using or programming a computer; a computer buff.
One who uses programming skills to gain illegal access to a computer network or file.
One who enthusiastically pursues a game or sport: a weekend tennis hacker.
A person who enjoys exploring the details of programmable systems and how to stretch their capabilities, as opposed to most users, who prefer to learn only the minimum necessary.
One who programs enthusiastically (even obsessively) or who enjoys programming rather than just theorizing about programming.
A person capable of appreciating hack value.
A person who is good at programming quickly.
An expert at a particular program, or one who frequently does work using it or on it; as in "a Unix hacker". (Definitions 1 through 5 are correlated, and people who fit them congregate.)
An expert or enthusiast of any kind. One might be an astronomy hacker, for example.
One who enjoys the intellectual challenge of creatively overcoming or circumventing limitations.

(Deprecated) A malicious meddler who tries to discover sensitive information by poking around. Hence "password hacker", "network hacker". The correct term is cracker.

http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=Hacker

[mrleachy]

well, plenty of opinions here, all with their various points, heres mine then:

in movies hacking appears to be portrayed as something of luck and speed with the latest technology and everything seems to just fall into place after a few minutes, everything almost always invlves no pre-written apps or script kiddie stuff as far as i've seen, also movies always seem to portray hackers only from the 'Black hat' point of view

in reality, its quite different, some people like to keep some disks with apps that are handy for them to use, a lot of people use known exploits or exploits that they generate (mainly skill, as you need to know where to look to find some of these, but can be luck if you 'stumble across' one just sitting there)

and i don't think all hackers get to sit around with a multi screen system with 2 ds3 lines attached to it (swordfish), hackers are all different in the way they work but most of the time (with the exception of script kiddies) it is just skill and knowledge and a little bit of luck on the side, id say about 70% + skill, the rest would be just luck i guess

thats my 4 cents $AU (2 cents over there in the US :-)

[mrleachy]

well, plenty of opinions here, all with their various points, heres mine then:

in movies hacking appears to be portrayed as something of luck and speed with the latest technology and everything seems to just fall into place after a few minutes, everything almost always invlves no pre-written apps or script kiddie stuff as far as i've seen, also movies always seem to portray hackers only from the 'Black hat' point of view

in reality, its quite different, some people like to keep some disks with apps that are handy for them to use, a lot of people use known exploits or exploits that they generate (mainly skill, as you need to know where to look to find some of these, but can be luck if you 'stumble across' one just sitting there)

and i don't think all hackers get to sit around with a multi screen system with 2 ds3 lines attached to it (swordfish), hackers are all different in the way they work but most of the time (with the exception of script kiddies) it is just skill and knowledge and a little bit of luck on the side, id say about 70% + skill, the rest would be just luck i guess

thats my 4 cents $AU (2 cents over there in the US :-)

[Maverick811]

Guess I'll throw in my views here...

The mentioned article, that was mostly luck with a side of script kiddieness. Hacking, in the true meaning of the word, is not using some exploit or some kiddie program that someone else created to gain access or perform some other action to a system. That's just being a script kiddie. Hacking would be actually finding vulnerabilities, writing code, etc to actually do gain access, create fixes, etc. Just because someone can use Sub7 means absolutely nothing to me - that's not hacking.

Luck happens to both a true hacker and a script kiddie. A script kiddie may download a program that exploits a 2 year old hole, and get lucky and find a system that hasn't patched that hole, whereby gaining access - all by luck that the system wasn't patched yet. A true 'hacker' possess all the skill, but luck may still come in handy for even a true 'hacker.'

[Maverick811]

Guess I'll throw in my views here...

The mentioned article, that was mostly luck with a side of script kiddieness. Hacking, in the true meaning of the word, is not using some exploit or some kiddie program that someone else created to gain access or perform some other action to a system. That's just being a script kiddie. Hacking would be actually finding vulnerabilities, writing code, etc to actually do gain access, create fixes, etc. Just because someone can use Sub7 means absolutely nothing to me - that's not hacking.

Luck happens to both a true hacker and a script kiddie. A script kiddie may download a program that exploits a 2 year old hole, and get lucky and find a system that hasn't patched that hole, whereby gaining access - all by luck that the system wasn't patched yet. A true 'hacker' possess all the skill, but luck may still come in handy for even a true 'hacker.'