Big Brother?

[jaguar291]

Originally posted here by xmaddness
rc, a lil more explanation on your comment?

Back in WWII Adolf Hitler wanted to issue a national I.D card to everyone that stated their religion, race, and other facts about them. It never worked due to the numerous problems in the late 1930s but rcgreen is just saying that Hitler finally got his national I.D.

[chefer]

I'm seeing pros and cons here.

Con: I don't like my information being centralized like this. Granted, I have a SS# and a drivers license, but they are 2 seperate cards, and they are maintained as such. So are my banking records. Fake cards don't frighten me here. It's the wealth of information that is to be instilled in one little chip that does. Not wise. We might as well just be tattooing targets on our foreheads when we get these things. I like the idea of a chip based card, but not at the possible expense of my life. I'm happy to carry around 2-3 extra slips of paper and have them run manually as it does provide an extra sense of security, as minute as it is.

Pro: Ease of convenience, it's all well and good. It is just that, another convenience. Act as a passport, prove your identity.

All in all, I like the concept. I don't necessarily like the potential outcome of these though. I like the minor sense of security I get from knowing that all my personal information is located on a card that is not likely to make it readily available. If they are ablet to harden this down so as to prevent identity theft or other forms of fraud, then lets do it.

[xmaddness]

Ah, okay, I've never heard that before. Well, I guess your right rc, he finally got his way. Its a good thing he isn't around to see it though. And I doubt religion and etnicity will be placed on the card. Well, actually it just may, in the database. But is it so hard to look at a person and tell? Ethnicity that is?

[GreekGoddess]

I do think the medical information is a great idea. Especially in a situation where a person has been in a car accident and the only identification they have is this ID card with their medical history in full detail recorded on the microchip. If this guy is in a coma, he's not going to be able to tell the doctors certain health factors that may be of danger to certain treatments. He may not have family to tell the doctors either...Hell, he may even be in a foreign country when this accident occured.

I don't necessarily think that your bank details need to be recorded onto this chip. I think it's enough to have a chip that stores vital personal information and medical information. It's no more dangerous to store that onto one card than it would be losing your wallet or purse as is now.

[jethro]

damn, I was hoping we were going to get a big discussion on the TV show "Big Brother"
(I hope Jade gets kicked out )

[wortcraft]

i say leave it as is. if i want someone to know something about be i will tell them. i dont need big brother to do that. it will never get better it never has. big bro can come out with what ever he wants to the bad guys also come out with something better or someway to get around it.


wortcraft

[xmaddness]

Dont you get it. Who defines who is not so nice. Do I , do you, does the next american hitler decide that. That is the problem with them.

Well, this is life. Get over it. Life isn't fair. Where you gathered this from, I have no clue. Would you mind explaining your thoughts more? I think your refering to when I said that you shouldn't be worried about it watching you, just the not so nice people. Well, If you have a criminal record, YOUR NOT SO NICE! If you are KNOWN to have ties with terrorist organizations, YOUR NOT SO NICE! Society decides who is not so nice, not me or you, it is society as a whole, so get over it.



BTW: this is a neg i got..

[rogue_scholarX]

Yes, but who is to define 'Terrorist Organization', antionline is run by hackers, maybe it's a terrorist organization? 2600 magazine disagrees with corporate power, and it's run by hackers maybe it's a terrorist organization? But the fact remains that the US uses terrorist strategies to get it's way almost every year. So does it only count as terrorism when it is someone else killing innocents?

The problem with these national ID cards is a complete centralization of data. They haven't released what this data is going to be used for except 'fighting terrorism', yes but who is to decide what terrorism is? Not society! Society decided Hitler should rule in WWII, society placed Mussolini in power in Fascist Italy! Maybe some of you should retake history class, this is all way too familiar. Who is to say that doctors even have access to the cards information? What happened to doctor-patient confidentiality? Does all this go to hell when you get one of these cards?

Well, If you have a criminal record, YOUR NOT SO NICE!

Who may I ask are you to dictate how nice someone is based on their criminal record? You can get a criminal record for Jaywalking! You can get a criminal record for speeding, talking on a cellphone in a car, driving without a license, not wearing a seatbelt, and many other pathetic laws meant to protect people from themselves. Let's not even mention the various other laws that are being debated right now. In Nazi Germany you would be labeled 'Not so Nice' If you were jewish, gay, black, christian, islamic, had brown eyes, it didn't matter. Again, im going to have to ask you to define 'Terrorist Organization'

Still using WWII as an example, the Polish, Italian, and French partisans(people fighting against Hitler and Mussolini) were the Terrorists, they were hunted down and shot. Im not saying that America is becoming Nazi germany, but unfortunately we are approaching a crossroads and one of the paths heads that way.

Now assuming it would be required to have this with you all the time, we have absolutely NOTHING like that in the US right now. No matter what there is no identification you are Required to have, or carry at any time. Unless you are in the military, or you drive.

As to ethnicity, most of the people in america have begun to erase ethnicity with extra-racial marriges, etc. Which is a good thing, because according to the laws of genetics it would allow people more immunities to disease, less likely-hood(sp?) of cancer etc.

Now im going to have to say that I didn't give you the neg. I don't agree with your opinions, and i extremely disagree with your reply to the neg.

I disagree with what you write, but I shall defend unto the death your right to write it.
-Voltaire

Dont you get it. Who defines who is not so nice. Do I , do you, does the next american hitler decide that. That is the problem with them.

I agree with him, though in a less excited way. Who gets to define who the government tracks down. Who is to decide what a terrorist is? Is it anyone who disagrees with the government? Is it anyone who decides to exercise their right to free speech?

[rcgreen]

The only reason governments desire to have
comprehensive information on people is to
make it easier to persecute groups and individuals
who are easy scapegoats.

To deflect public criticism away from mismanagement
of their duties, they create phoney enemies and
entertain the public by "making an example" of some
poor shmuck.

They did it in ancient Rome.
They did it in revolutionary France
They did it in Czarist Russia
They did it in communist Russia
They did it in Nazi Germany
Uganda, Rwanda, Liberia, Argentina
And yes, Britain (against the Irish), America (slavery)
South Africa (aparthied), Zimbabwe (at this very hour)

The purpuse of a constitution is to restrain government
and protect the liberties of the people against
government abuse of their rights.

They don't need data on my race or religion or medical history
in order to defend the land from foreign invasion.
Otherwise, why are we wasting so much money
on all those aircraft carriers, nuclear subs, and tanks?

[ing]

rcgreen and rogue_scholarX i agree with you guys what will they want with that but just have more control over the ppl what will be next have a chip in your body with all that information of course they will say is for your good so we will no who you are what are you doing if you agree with us and if you get in are shooting line well bad luck.
oh **** of wake up every time there is a terrorist atack or something similar the goverments styeps further on the freedom of you guys saying is for our good that is to keep track on terrorist oh ya well what if in their langiage am a terrorist (am not of course) but maybe one day if i disagee with something then i'll be but with them i will be called terrorist just because am in their book that
.
of course am not gonna but bombs but maybe the say well you are against us you religious beliefs and polotical reasoning are agoainst us i'll be banned like a terrorist just like that.
i don't think that is funny and i pray to god that those things to pass but they will pass because the majority of the ppl or don't care if there rights and freedoms are step on if there is something to gain such us security. But ask you that question will you really be secure?, i don't think so)
is it worth it worth to die in freedom or to live in slavery, i prefer to die in freedom

quote:
I disagree with what you write, but I shall defend unto the death your right to write it.
-Voltaire