The Myth of Mercy Killing

[zepherin]

Originally posted here by 8*B@LL


if i'm not mistaken that quote should read "The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

That was never part of the original quote:

(Samuel) Johnson said something close, but he was following in others' footsteps. In Boswell's Life of Johnson, in an entry marked April 16, 1775, Boswell quotes Johnson as saying (on some other occasion), "Hell is paved with good intentions." Note, no prefatory "the road to..." Boswell's editor, Malone, added a footnote indicating this is a 'proverbial sentence,' and quoting an earlier 1651 source (yet still not in the common wording).

Robert Wilson, in the newsgroup alt.quotations, provided two other sources prior to Johnson. John Ray, in 1670, cited as a proverb "Hell is paved with good intentions." Even earlier than that, it's been attributed to Saint Bernard of Clairvaux (1091-1153), as "Hell is full of good intentions or desires." Just how it got to the road to Hell being paved this way, and not Hell itself, I don't know.

http://www.samueljohnson.com/apocryph.html#6

[Lady HaxX0r]

I also think this article is typical of the christian "my morals are everyone morals" attitude that I see. What is wrong with letting people make there own choices, and if they are wrong then let them go to hell? why not let me go to hell if I so choose?

jcmcb,

I think the rationale behind the type of attitude that you're criticising here is that
1) They believe they are right, and that their morals are sound
2) They believe it is God's command that they act out of love for mankind [see 10 Commandments]
3) They confuse these two along the way, and feel that if they know something to be good and right, they should cause everyone else to live by these standards, so that they can experience a full and rewarding life

In conclusion, they believe that they are acting with the interests of others at heart, they just get it very wrong. And then again, wasn't Hitler acting with the interests of others at heart? But then if you believe something to be right, surely you are duty bound to endorse that, as a matter of integrity? I'm not saying I condone the whole 'there is only ONE way, OUR way' attitude at all, just offering an explanation for better understanding.

In a way the same goes for the subject of the thread; I think it's terrible that people can think of killing as acceptable, but conversely those who do it probably believe they are right, therefore the motivation was pure. How do you judge it? The act or the intention? Road to hell again I suppose...

XXX

[billgates891]

I do not like that, it's like playing God.....

[JP]

Greetings All:

This is an issue very close to me.

All through-out high school I volunteered at the local Geriatric Center (a publicly funded nursing home). My job, basically, was to sit with people that were dying, that had no family or friends near-by (or at all). By the time I stopped (shortly after the death of a woman that was particularly difficult to watch, and for me to deal with), I had logged well over 1,000 hours.

I think anyone that opposes the "Right To Die" movement should spend some time in one of these places. Death isn't always (and from my experience, almost always isn't) the calm, peaceful, "spiritual" experience that they portray it as on TV. Usually, it's a long, drawn-out, and painful process, filled with fear and suffering. Watching people struggle for each breath as they're coughing up blood, with that look on their face (the expression on someone's face when they know they are dying, is like none-other), is something that I think would change most people's minds.

Why should we, as a society, force people that have lived lives full of dignity to go through such suffering?

I'm sure that Christians will start with their load of "god will take them when it's time" bullshit (personally, I'm an atheist). Trust me, if there is a god, he's not there helping to comfort and ease the suffering of people going through a 3 week long dying process from lung cancer, or heart failure.

In the end, no matter how good of a life you've lived, no matter how many people love you, no matter how many friends and family members you have, no matter how "faithful you've been to god", you alone have to bare that pain and suffering. Therefore, you alone should be able to decide if that's something you want to leave up to "god", or if it's something that you want to be able to take control over.

[zaggy]

IMHO Right To Die and Mercy Killings are two entirely different things.

My grandfather had lung cancer and when it was near the end for him, when his lungs only functioned 5%, every breath was torture, I prayed for him to go (not to God, just prayed). A friend is currently dying of cancer, she was just moved to the pallative ward at the hospital. She is only 35 years old and suffering more than a lifetime's worth of pain in a few months. I have had more experience with death and suffering than I care to think about.

The difference between the two to me is, although I prayed for their horrible suffering to end, was I ready and able to be the one who ended their suffering?

It is one thing to wish that ppl close to us didn't suffer and to wish them speedy release of death but I personally couldn't be the one to end their lives. It has absolutely nothing to do with God, or anyone else for that matter. It is a personal thing, I wouldn't be able to live with myself.

[preacherman481]

[quote]"I'm sure that Christians will start with their load of "god will take them when it's time" bullshit (personally, I'm an atheist). Trust me, if there is a god, he's not there helping to comfort and ease the suffering of people going through a 3 week long dying process from lung cancer, or heart failure.
In the end, no matter how good of a life you've lived, no matter how many people love you, no matter how many friends and family members you have, no matter how "faithful you've been to god", you alone have to bare that pain and suffering. Therefore, you alone should be able to decide if that's something you want to leave up to "god", or if it's something that you want to be able to take control over.[quote]

Hi all,
Well, I do believe in God. I believe that ultimately God is in control of this world and not us. We go through
life struggling and scrambling to maintain the myth that we are in control of our own destiny. Anyone who thinks we are
in control should spend some time with some farmers. These people, who depend on rain and other conditions
that they can't control would quickly set them straight. If a drought lasted long enough we would all be dead through starvation. Are we in control? I don't think so. Death itself shreds the thinly veiled illusion that we are in control of our lives. Suicide (any form of suicide) is just a futile last attempt to maintain the control that we didn't have in the first place. I don't believe in prolonging life for the terminally ill just because we have the technology to do so. That is just another form of striving for control. But I do draw the line at euthanasia. I believe that we should live our lives to the end.

Does God sometimes choose not to alleviate human suffering? Yes, sometimes God doesn't. But I have come to the conclusion (living as a Christian and from the Scriptures) that it is not God's purpose to always make life easy for us. We would like that, but it doesn't work that way. "Faithfulness" to God does not exempt us from suffering. God doesn't owe us anything. We don't earn an easy life by serving God. Just look at some of the people in the Bible. They served God and they suffered because of it. God created a perfect world that humans have corrupted by sin. In God's original intention for humankind, death and suffering was not part of the picture. Now they are a part of life. Sometimes we suffer because of our own sin. Sometimes we suffer because of the sin of others. Sometimes we suffer just because we are in a world infested with sin. Sin and suffering are a reality. And God doesn't always choose
to act in ways we would like.

Are we alone? No, we aren't. Not unless we reject God and choose to be alone. I think we often reject God, not because of some theological point we can't accept, but because we want to remain in control of our lives. We can't accept the fact that someone else is in control. We want to retain the illusion that we are. We can't give over the steering wheel to someone else. We're not alone unless we choose to be alone by rejecting God. Psalm 23 says, "Yea,
though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, you (God) are with me. Your rod and your staff, they comfort me."

Dignity doesn't come from suicide. Dignity comes from facing the worst that life can bring us with an assurance that no matter what happens, God loves and take us to him when we die. I invite anyone who wants real dignity in life to do this:

1) Trust that Jesus died on the cross for our sins.
2)Confess that you have sinned and are a sinner.
3) Ask God to forgive you and give you a new relationship with him.
3) Follow Jesus.
__________________

[rcgreen]

you alone have to bare that pain and suffering. Therefore, you alone should be able to decide

The HMO will be the one making that decision, and your quality
of life will not be the criterion. Rather, it will be the quality
of their bank account.

[rcgreen]

Ric Burger -- a diabetic, a wheelchair user and a spokesman for disabled citizens in the state -- noted: "The fact that the state of Oregon will not properly fund our personal attendant services, yet will pay for us to die, amounts to nothing less than cultural genocide."

http://www.prolifeinfo.org/art010.html


BTW, the above article is by Nat Hentoff, and he is not
a "right winger" or a christian fundamentalist.

[kadeng]

In the end, no matter how good of a life you've lived, no matter how many people love you, no matter how many friends and family members you have, no matter how "faithful you've been to god", you alone have to bare that pain and suffering. Therefore, you alone should be able to decide if that's something you want to leave up to "god", or if it's something that you want to be able to take control over. [/B][/QUOTE]

My girl-frend[she has cancer] agrees total and so do i!
She told me when her end is near and her live is one hell of pain when she can t ask a doctor to put her to sleep,i MUST ask and i will.

[Ponders]

It should be our choice whether or not we should be able to. I believe that some lives are wasted.