*moved* What's up with the weak U.N.?

[Big_Bolo]

I posted a long post about this whole issue and two dudes from Belgium and Holland seem to be anti-american government. So what I'm saying is those guys posted intelligent posts according to me. I would like to see some our americans on antionline post their opinion on what they know about this issue and not just sound like a broken record i.e president Bush "Iraq needs to disarm" every time he gets asked a question. And please do not repeat what u have been hearing on the news we all know about it already. Just what u know and make it intelligent. I think most of u base ur comments on what u hear on the news which a lot of it is propaganda and many of americans have no idea on whats going on in the world except for their on country.

[sirrahj]

Big_Bolo: How intelligent do you want? I will work on it. Until then I would also question where you elicited your intel from on how America fights wars? I am real curious on that. Also the generalizations of Americans is frankly insulting and offensive. There are just a 'few' of us working in this 'pig' of a country to change the system; however, yours and other OUS people who keep hammering us with generalizations and insults does not help anything. If you want our country to change overall, then provide some possible solutions, otherwise get off the soapbox. Lastly, and this is from experience, you would be amazed to know the real effectiveness of our military. Yes - some of the incidents you mentioned in a past post are true and embarassing, but there are many others, that don't even hit the news that were successful. Don't worry though, the US will go down some year and then you can all rejoice.

Also to start to answer Big_Bolo's request on what should we do here. I will tell you.

1. Track down and liquidate Bin Laden, preferrably on all public media. Why, because we need to show the other terrorists what will happen when we catch them. The trial is the time takes for the liquidation to begin and their life ebbs away.
2. Track down and liquidate any terrorist group and their members publicly on all media. See number 1. for details.
3. Work with international community to resolve NKorea crisis.
4. US/UK/AUS and all other 'pro-war' countries pull out of the Gulf and let GE/FR/BE start handling to see if we can avert war; and either slap Saddam in line to comply to already broken resolutions or liquidate him publicly and have a new power established that will comply to the UN resolutions.
5. US to suck it up and actually with with UN council members and NATO on rest of resolutions; here admittedly, is where I need to research more.
6. On the issue of greed/arrogance - which seems to be a lot of reason for other countries to dislike the US. That, I am at a loss for at this time, I think we would need to start with all countries polticians.

Quick question for you all: Who of you have served in your respective armed forces? I ask because there seems to be a lot of opinion about the military and I wanted to know where those opinions come from. If you don't feel like answering, that's ok, I am just curious and not trying to start yet another battle.

Any thoughts on my UN post? Can we actually do anything to change it, or are we just going to sit around and b1tch about it?

Thanks all.

[Big_Bolo]

sirrahj I was not trying to insult americans not at all. I have a lot of american friends and some are like family. The reason why I posted my first reply was to shade some insight over whats really going on and whats really happening. And believe me its a really broad topic to talk about. However, KorpDeath sounded ignorant, angry, arrogant and full of hate if I can say that towards Iraq. To me it seemed that he had no idea of the history and implications involved in this entire issue and was only basing his comments from what he heard on american television.

how America fights wars?

to answer ur question. Everyone knows that america fight a technological war. Thats their strategy, which there is nothing wrong with its strategy and thats what war and combat is all about. So they bomb and bomb endlessly until there is laterally nothing left then they send in the troops. The reason why I pointed out those lost battles is because KorpDeath was convinced the US troops were unbeatable. Which is not true we all know that US troops are not trained for trench warefare but technological or what u may call surgicall warefare.


As for ur number one comment I'll only say that "Terrorism is an act of fighting against oppression" or let me put this way what does a cat do when it is cornered and has no where to go ? It hisses and strikes as hard and as deadly as possible at its aggressor. Hey Nelson Mandela was a terrorist in South Africa because the blacks were oppressed by apartheid. He fought went to jail and came out a Hero. Bin Laden is just the same he doesn't like the fact that americans are oppressing Islamic countries. However I agree with rest of ur points on some of those solutions u mentioned.

I did not serve in the army but my opinions come from people that have served in the military in my native country. Some who have fought in wars in the passed and recently. And people who saw the events happen when they were younger. And I also got it from political sources, reliable news channels and radio stations.

Overall u had some good comments based on what u know and didn't just blab about what ur president has been saying for the past months. And thats how discussions should be.

[KorpDeath]

I asked a question BIg_Bolo, that's all. I never said our troops were unbeatable, I never implied that.

You know what pisses me off morethan anything is the fact I have a solid argument and you can't take it. You all want to make excuses instead of standing up for what's proper.

Ignorant? not hardly. I don't watch T.V.. save for the history channel. Yeah I'm sure that's the channel that the U.S gov't uses to brainwash people right?

Hatred for Iraq? Again, hardly. You think I'm going to waste my time hating a country full of sand and camel ****?

Arogant? Maybe. But I've been called worse, now if we are all done insulting me and persoanlly attacking me lets get on with the discussion at hand.



Can anyone tell me why the U.N. won't stand by it's own freaking resolution? I'm not speaking on NATO, just the U.N. resolution. Got brains?

[firestarter5]

"why do you have a problem with Israel?"

This has been a test of the Emergency Say No More Broadcast System. If this had been an actual emergency.....

162 countries in the world.

1 country has more resolutions than Iraq.

1 country stipulates it is "against the law" to refuse to do business with Israel.

Iraq has land based weapons.

Iraq has land based weapons that pose no threat to the USA.

Iraq has the worlds 2nd largest oil reserves with a confirmed 100+ billion barrels.

This impending(?) war isn't about oil or Israel.

That seems apparent......

[KPATTE456]

A whole counrty felt the brunt of our wrath. We over ran thier country with our military, took out thier government, in the persuit of one man and a handfull of his followers, alot of which werent even citizens of that country. I think if that was to happen here by some other countries military, Id feel the same hatred towards them as the Pakistanis feel toward Americans.People who had nothing to do with the 9/11 attack on us or the people who perpetrated it paid a pretty big price, loss of life, property, thier homes destroyed just because thier government wouldnt give into pressure from our government.

You said " Without war there can be no peace" If war were obliterated, wouldnt the only thing left be peace?
As far as my progression I think I learned the hard way that the use of force is not generally accepted in our society and is seen as a regression instead of progression. Cave men used sticks, modern man benefits by diplomacy. I do agree that there are time where force is necessary but do not agree that the Situation in Iraq requires force at this time. Sadam isnt threatening us or any one else, he is allowing the inspections and it seems that some of the UN countries feel the same way or im sure they would have taken action long before now, especially since the European countries are in a close proximity to Iraq and have the most to lose by him not disarming.

Questions to you Korp: What is the actual UN resolution?What exactly does it say?Does it give a timetable for Sadam to disarm? If it does why has nothing been done to enforce it before now? Does it give the US permission to act militarily without the full consent of the UN ? Does it define punisiments for non compliance?
I know that I personaly havent read it (the resolution of 12 years ago) have you?

Oh and why is your postion a " solid argument " as you put it but other peoples positions are just "excuses" ? A little narrow minded dont you think for someone thats so "progressed" ?

[Spyder32]

Originally posted here by KorpDeath
I asked a question BIg_Bolo, that's all. I never said our troops were unbeatable, I never implied that.

You know what pisses me off morethan anything is the fact I have a solid argument and you can't take it. You all want to make excuses instead of standing up for what's proper.

Ignorant? not hardly. I don't watch T.V.. save for the history channel. Yeah I'm sure that's the channel that the U.S gov't uses to brainwash people right?

Hatred for Iraq? Again, hardly. You think I'm going to waste my time hating a country full of sand and camel ****?

Arogant? Maybe. But I've been called worse, now if we are all done insulting me and persoanlly attacking me lets get on with the discussion at hand.



Can anyone tell me why the U.N. won't stand by it's own freaking resolution? I'm not speaking on NATO, just the U.N. resolution. Got brains?

Heh, lemme take a stab at you, KorpDeath. I agree with quite a few of your points, but this post in particular I wanted to respond to. First..

Hatred for Iraq? Again, hardly. You think I'm going to waste my time hating a country full of sand and camel ****?

Maybe not you, but the Bush Administration. Maybe they are after revenge? I mean, honestly. Bush's father was threatended and almost killed by Saddam. So, what is the natural thing to do? Son is in office, so goes to avenge his father. If not that, then it's the country, not for the dirt and camel ****, but maybe for the oil? I'm pretty sure it's a big oil pool to me, and if we get Iraq, we're set. So, that's that.

Ignorant? not hardly. I don't watch T.V.. save for the history channel. Yeah I'm sure that's the channel that the U.S gov't uses to brainwash people right?

No, but saying we're going after Iraq because it pose's a 'threat' to the American people and interest's is bullshit. Continiously saying how Saddam is evil and he's the devil and all that BS is brainwashing at times. Sure, he is evil. But is that honestly why we're going after him? Personally, I find it funny that a few days after we start making allegations that Saddam is somehow connected with Al Quada and countries start doubting that, that magically a Bin Laden video tape come's out and mention's his name, call's him and his government infidel's, etc. Kinda strange, and those who are reading this and are smart know what I'm getting at.

In closing, I'd like to say that I agree with points made from People going for war with Iraq and people against the war. I, myself don't see a valid enough argument to go to war with them, and think it's BS. KorpDeath, I don't think your arrogant or anything, you have some nice points (some I agree with even). Thank's for reading this everyone, I anticipate a response.

[wsemperfi]

Regarding the present US policy toward Iraq,read please what Charles Krauthammer wrote in The Washington Post (Fri.14).No one presented more clear (in my oppinion) than he and my hat goes off to him for that.The title of mentioned article is "Holiday from history";maybe the young people that participate to this forum will understand that the history that was teached in schools in the last 15-20 years, was a bit incomplete. KorpDeath,UN decizions weren't ever faimos for their wisdom ;no wonder that dictators are amng us,still.Just my two bits.

[HTRegz]

I couldn't even finish reading this form.. I have to post now...
Sorry for making bashing, but most of you American's posting to this form need to grow up. You are the only country that feels the way you do, sure you'll find a few people that'll agree with you, but the countries on a whole do not.. Canadians for one are getting p*ssed off with you.. I hear it every day, on the news, in the classroom, out in public. You seem to think you are the Policing Agency of the world... You AREN'T.. u need to realize this.... I'm seeing posts.. Especially by KorpDeath (i'm guessing you are a card carrying member of the NRA because you are a completely and utter moron).. I cut many many lines out of these posts, but my favourite was this:

And as far as Germany getting involved, let's just say that they got their asses handed to them by the U.S. et al because they wanted to dominate the world

I do believe you should go back and learn your history again, and real history, not the way you teach it to make the US look like hero's... The US never handed Germany their asses. I could prolly count the number of American's that actually entered germany on my hands. Sure you showed Japan who was boss, but how'd u do that.. by using Nuclear Weapons... Nukes should NOT exist, yet they do. Oppenheimer himself said "I am become Death, the shatterer of worlds." He realized nukes were a mistake after the first test. Yet the rest of you haven't realized that. The Americans didn't even enter the War until after Pearl Harbour, before that you could care less what happened to the world. WWII had been ongoing for over 2 years when you finally decided hey we were attacked we should maybe get involved now.. There's hell to pay. Did the cold war with Russia not make u realize you can't bully people. No one gives a **** that you are the US... you're nothing more than a bunch of lil boys with guns, still unsure of how they work, but you know u can do damage if you use them enough. Let the world handle itself and focus in on your own country.. deal with your 11000+ national murders (compared to the next closest country which is 300+), deal with your poverty, your racial segregation (and yes it still does occur, don't give me bullshit that it doesn't), deal with your unemployment and deal with your gun problems. After you've fixed all that and you can actually say you are a decent country, then get involved with world-wide affairs, until then keep your noses out of where they don't belong.
Sept. 11th was a horrible horrible day, but you got what was coming to you (the innocent people didn't deserve to die, but neither do the innocent people your country bombs every day), They were killed by people trained by your own CIA, funded by your government. You should take heed to what's going on at home before you worry about anyone else... Smarten up

[KorpDeath]

I just asked a simple question and this is what I get?

Let the country that has done no wrong cast the first stone.....

P.S. And answer my question if you can? I'd really like an answer.

P.S.S. If I'm so ignorant and blinded by the media then enlighten me.